Keeping the blogosphere posted on the goings on of the world of submarines since late 2004... and mocking and belittling general foolishness wherever it may be found. Idaho's first and foremost submarine blog. (If you don't like something on this blog, please E-mail me; don't call me at home.)

Wednesday, December 17, 2008

Navy Working Uniform (NWU) Idiocy

Navy Times has an article about feedback they received after writing about the Navy's planned new rules for the wear of the new Navy Working Uniform -- the "blue cammies of death". The Navy put out a message saying that the new working uniforms would not be allowed to be worn off base, not even for "brief stops" allowed with the current working uniforms:
The new rules are more restrictive than the regs covering the to-be-replaced utilities and wash khakis, as well as the current woodland cammies and flight suits.
Current uniform regulations allow sailors to make brief stops — such as pumping gas, picking up prescriptions and dropping off kids at day care — in the current uniforms. None of this will be allowed once sailors and officers begin wearing the Navy Working Uniform, which will be available to purchase in the Norfolk, Va., area next month...
...At the time of the message’s release, Navy officials told Navy Times that the commuting rules for the NWU were identical to the rules for all current working uniforms. Those officials have since corrected themselves, saying that the current rules for utilities and wash khakis do allow for brief stops.
Navy Times, on Tuesday morning, requested further clarification on the reason for the rule change from the office of the Chief of Naval Operations.
The rule change will likely cause problems for deck-plate leaders who need to enforce them.
That’s because once the NWU begins its two-year rollout, there will be two sets of uniform rules on the street — one for the NWU, authorizing no routine stops, and the current, and more liberal, rules for the rest of the uniforms.
Dukerulz has more on this story, including a report of a quote from the CNO on this issue. I think the Navy runs into this problem because they populate the various "Task Force" groups with people who are never going to sea again, and don't have the guts to retire; they'd rather take up office space and sit around talking about the Big Picture when they're not going to have to live by the ridiculous rules they're promulgating.

I'm hoping the new MCPON, a submariner, lets the CNO know that he got bad advice when he put the original message out, and will retract it as soon as possible.

(Among the "Big Picture" items the asshats who worry about these things came up with is a description of the "emblem" that is embedded in the pattern of the Navy Working Uniform. From the message: "EMBEDDED THROUGHOUT THE FABRIC ARE MINIATURIZED FEATURES OF THE SEAL OF THE NAVY FLAG WITH THE LETTERS "USN" DIRECTLY BENEATH IT. THE SEAL INCLUDES AN ANCHOR, A THREE-MASTED SQUARE RIGGED SHIP, AND AN EAGLE. THE EMBLEM WILL BE ABBREVIATED "ACE", WHICH STANDS FOR ANCHOR, USS CONSTITUTION, AND EAGLE." Seriously, who in their right mind gives a rat's ass about the abbreviation for an emblem on a seal on a uniform?)


Anonymous Anonymous said...

This entire NWU debacle is borderline criminal. In a time of WAR and ECONOMIC CRISIS we are requiring our Sailors to purchase new uniforms and spending U.S. Navy time and money in support of that change.

And we didn't even address the original problem: our enlisted Sailors didn't have a working uniform that they could wear off base.

The current dungarees are fine. The current wash khakis are fine.
Send a NAVADMIN that canx's the NWU, and authorize those uniforms to be worn off base.

This NWU thing has got to stop before more time and money are wasted.

Bubblehead: here's your chance to effect change on behalf of your active duty brethren!

12/17/2008 8:00 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The entire concept of the uniform change is a disgrace to the Navy. The brass had an opportunity to restore some credibility with the fleet and they completely blew it. No one is going to wear this uniform until they have to as long as it's requirements are more restrictive. And the Navy will be caught completely off guard when their stock of supply disappears just before the end date for wear.

Oh and the "ACE" reminds me of the "EGA" that the Marines wear complete with it's own 3-letter acronym. It's quite embarassing when the Navy is instituting Marine tradition into our uniforms.

12/17/2008 8:39 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Who remembers the change to the double-breasted uniform jacket for E-6 and below? How about utilities - the flammable ones?

Why is it that the Navy can't get uniforms right? I can only guess that bubblehead is correct, and I'll add that those in charge of this stupidity were selected based on a serious lack of common sense.

It's very hard for seniors to defend the Navy when the junior folks point out gross stupidity like this.

12/17/2008 8:39 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

This uniform program needs to stop. Waste of time and money.

No COB in his right mind will have Sailors where this thing on submarines, and no CO in his right mind will replace wash khakis in port with this horrible uniform.

IF we fail to kill this WASTE of TIME and MONEY, then submariners will just commute to/from work in civvies and change into poopie suits once on board.

Un-effing-believable. What a waste.


12/17/2008 8:57 AM

Blogger Chap said...

This "not allowed to wear home" garbage comes directly from grand skimmer officer tradition. Those are the guys who have tried or succeeded to do that little trick to dungarees, coveralls, utilities, etc.

That's the cultural thing you have to kill--and the shoes build it into their culture.

The "ACE" silliness? Anon #2 has it right; much of the uniform design is in reaction to the relative success of the Marine digital camo.

And you should see all these E-2s around here with khaki shirts and E-2 collar devices. They can wear that, the Johnny Cash, the sungarees, or if in the right rate the woodland camo to the same place. Some "uni"form...

12/17/2008 9:52 AM

Blogger Sandy Salt said...

The asshats are showing why they need to retire. This whole uniform is a waste of time and money. Plus there are some really dumb things to it like the fact that guys on ship have to wear boots that have to be shined, while on shore duty the rough-out boots are authorized. Why are they forcing the 8 point pain in the butt cap vice command ball caps.

It also doesn't address the problem with the fact that Navy has to wear the Army's cammies when in Iraq with them. The DOD is screwing the pooch on this because there are 5 or 6 different uniforms being used in theater between all the branches. How is this smart or economical. The AF has its problems with their new uniform and since the Marines don't play well with others we have the general choas. The Army's ACU is pretty good due to velcro and zippers, but it won't camo anywhere on earth.

The DOD needs to put an end to this BS and designate a single theater uniform and if cammies it is then a single pattern for all services, vice the current free for all.

12/17/2008 11:03 AM

Blogger chief torpedoman said...

I don't know for sure, but I would be willing to hazard a guess that a sailor could wear the new PT uniform to/from work and still make short stops on the way.

We must remember that there is still no law against stupidity.

12/17/2008 12:05 PM

Blogger J120 Bowman said...

**Warning** Completely sarcastic post forthcoming.....

Welllllll.....let's consider for one moment that "we" brought this on ourselves. What? How can this be? Please tell us!

Wellllllll......I'm sure some desk riding, never-been-to-sea, non-qual, O2 breathing, water drinking, food eating, movie watching, card playing, porn reading, san tank filling NUB looked at some Navy-wide "opinion survey" and saw that one of the biggest complaints was the current prison, I mean, working uniform.

Welllllll....I know how to fix that! Let's change it! We'll do more surveys, and pick more desk riding ass kissing wannabes to "test" the new uniforms and make it a morale issues so some Admiral will think he/she (no pun intended) is doing something for the blueshirts (are we all "blue shirts" or "digititized shirts" now?) to improve the working conditions.

See? It's all our fault. We were stupid enough to complain about something we had no power to control and someone took us seriously!

The moral of the story you ask?


And we all lived happily ever after!

-The End-

12/17/2008 12:44 PM

Anonymous Ross Kline said...

I guess I picked the right time to retire.

Sorry for leaving behind the morons that came up with this garbage.

12/17/2008 12:44 PM

Blogger outdoorspro said...

Coveralls on ships and boats is the perfect uniform.

The black and tans i really, really like, mostly because both the whites and "johnny cash's" are both horrible and the B&T's look damn sharp and professional.

Camos...ugh. Pretty silly for ships. Maybe useful for the folks who are already wearing camos, but otherwise...

The Army folks wear their camos around town and seem to get good responses from the public. If the Navy brass actually liked their choice, you'd think they wouldn't be so embarassed by having them seen in public.

As for the new work shirts, khakis, etc. i heard a chief recently respond when asked about them, "they're not khaki, they're TAN."

12/17/2008 2:31 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I remember hearing a story about Rickover, he apparently told Congress that they should divide the 4-stripers in Washington into two groups. One group would be given a room,desk,tablets,pencils,and a large trash can, all to be used until they reached retirement. The other group would be tasked with useful work. I would recommend this for the uniform czars.

12/17/2008 3:20 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Personally, I think the new black & tan uniforms look sharp. I've seen a few active duty sailors here in Bremerton wearing them around town. I've even seen a few girls turn their heads and look twice at these guys because it is a great looking uniform. It's my understanding that the black & tans are a helluva' lot more comfortable to wear, less of a problem in maintaining and cleaning and less costly too.

Now the mastermind who designed these new USN uniforms needs to take a trip to the USAF side of the house and offer some badly needed council (maybe a direct intervention) regarding the latest AF uniform change...which so far, ain't too pretty. What I've seen so far, depicts a glorified mail man who looks as though he's ready to invade poland.

As for the new USN camo uniforms, I've not seen those yet. I would hope the off base restrictions will be amended so a sailor can make a pit stop for groceries, gas and pick up the kids at day care in town.

Thanks, J.

12/17/2008 4:39 PM

Anonymous Veemann said...

So what exactly is the NWU camoflage scheme supposed to be good for other than making a sailor who falls overboard virtually impossible to find? The new khaki shirt uniform scheme seems to serve no useful purpose other than to make sailors look more like marines (body fat differential aside). Of course, there is that new PT uniform. Thanks again TFU for a job done on all of us....

12/17/2008 5:14 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The black n tans are OK. I'm not real keen on them just due to aesthetics (IMO), but it replaces two uniforms so: simpler = better.

The digi-cams? Pure f'ing lunacy. Sure, if the skimmers want a new-fangled piece of gear to press and look silly in, have at it. I can't imagine those things ever seeing the light of day in the sub force beyond when they're absolutely required (I already feel bad for the POODs and Sentries). Even still I was at least resigned to yet another piece of Navy retardation that I could happily ignore. But not even allowing brief stops in the working uniform? Seriously now, there's a large group of policy makers that need to realize that an average sailor's day does not fully revolve around the Navy and indeed involves interactions with the real world. Although they have apparently lost touch with that as well.
My solution: bring back the old school dungarees. Ass pockets on the front of your pants, need I say more by way of recommendation.

12/17/2008 6:39 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

*sigh* JARGON...

12/17/2008 6:50 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm glad I've never had to see a pair of those dungarees since I got out. Battery acid was hell on them...

I've seen the baby nukes running around in the new black and tans, and at first I wasn't a big fan, but they're growing on me.

12/17/2008 7:07 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"I've seen a few active duty sailors here in Bremerton wearing them around town. I've even seen a few girls turn their heads and look twice at these guys because it is a great looking uniform."

You can make a Bremerton girl turn around just by eating a hamburger or piece of chicken...but that's a different story!

As for the uniforms, this is just another reminder of how top heavy the Navy is. There are a lot of senior officers and enlisted people who have nothing really useful to do.

Hopefully MC West, warts and all, will get rid of some of this foolishness and let Sailors get back to being Sailors.

Although I am retired now, there are still times when I see guys I know in town in their uniforms. They start making excuses about why they are out in town. I just say, "dude, I don't care what your doing, I think you look ok...go for's a stupid rule anyway...but here comes the base CMC, so you might want to go that way."

12/17/2008 7:17 PM

Blogger Harry Buckles said...

TFU is fraud, waste and abuse. The NWU is an attempt to prove the Air Force wrong in their thinking that they are the gayest service.

Presumably one could determine with some scientific accuracy what camouflage pattern hides the wearer the best. Then use this uniform for all services while letting the Marine Corps and the Navy have eight-pointed covers. This would save the taxpayers much money by both eliminating duplication and sending all four equivalents of TFU out to pasture.

12/17/2008 8:52 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I personally don't give a crap what the uniform as long as I get that gortex parka with fleece liner. Transferring from Hawaii to Groton CT in November highlights once again how the Navy has never managed to get uniforms that work in cold weather.

I'd wear purple and green digicams as long as they include that parka. Maybe a red rubber nose too.

I just can't wait until I'm told I can't put pens in the pen holders in the sleeves, that I can't put stuff in the thigh pockets, that I can't use 99% of what was designed into that uniform to go along with all the other nonsensical rules built into it. I bet we won't be able to use the hood on the jacket while it's raining.

In other good news, the wool watchcap regs have been modified to allow you to wear it over your ears in cold weather. Imagine that.

12/18/2008 7:28 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I feel the same way about my gortex parka and pants. I absolutely refused to give it up. When I ETSed, I some how "lost" my gortex set. It "magically" re-appeared in my luggage once I was home and unpacking. The fact that a gortex set in the AF is considered a clothing item and not actual equipment, I didn't have to pay for the "loss" or get wrote up for it. Plus, 3rd generation gortex was coming out fairly soon any way.

As for the pen holders in the left shoulder sleeve, my squadron did allow us to carry pens. However, the pen in question had to be a service issue black ball point pen. You know, the ones that never work when you need to write down some important information quickly.

Yeah, gortex is definitely one of the better inventions for wet & cold weather.

Thanks, J.

12/18/2008 10:57 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Blueshirts on sea duty are supposed to live on the ship. There is no need to ever leave the base, unless it is to your new duty station!
Married and/ or shore duy may be different, but I have no knowledge of those....

12/18/2008 11:47 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

This will be my third uniform in my 16 years unless they are willing to let me go back to the orriginal dungarees( was good enough for WWII) then i really dont care.... underway i will be in a poopie suit and sneekers anyways.... what erks me is that not only do they make a mish mash of uniforms for the new B&T's but the only thing they actually made new for us lowly E-6 and below was the jacket to go with them great another 80 bucks to replace the jacket i only needed that one cold day I had to wear the blues so many years ago.

12/18/2008 12:43 PM

Anonymous ExMSPNavET said...

The NWU is just another symptom if the failure of leadership that is becoming more and more prevalent in today's Navy. Most of the Navy leadership is far more concerned with looking professional than being professional. They care more about appearences than functionality or capability. The black and tans I get. I think they are actually a great idea. They don't look bad, they replace two different uniforms, and they make use of many existing uniform items which will save sailors money. These new working uniforms do nothing to improve the professional appearence of sailors or the Navy, and they do little to improve the functionality of the uniform itself. As someone who has expierienced a REAL man overboard casualty, the NWU will liklley lead to the loss of someones life when they are unable to be located after falling overboard. This is worse than failed leadership. This is incredible stupidity. My chief explained to me that the idea was to get a uniform that one could get dirty and still look good in. Everyone knows you can't get a Navy uniform dirty! It will look like you work in it! I wonder what will happen if we get grease on these? OMFG! If we need cammies, then why not wear the standard green cammies of the Army or Marines? BTW that uniform allowance only covers HALF of the co$t to sailors to purchase the required number of uniforms. Hopefully, someone in the Navy leadership will relaize the wastefullness and stupidity of this program and kill the NWU. That being said, I seriously doubt that we have leadership that is that capable anymore.

12/18/2008 1:19 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

What a crock, this will make some Chief MS's day, they can have some other bs uniform reg to bother people with. What is the big fucking deal about stopping at a store, or pumping gas in uniform. Isn't the navy proud of their uni's. Meanwhile, the Air Force in their camo can go do any freaking thing they want. Good god the navy higher ups are fucking stupid.

12/18/2008 1:33 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yeah, that's true about the AF.
I don't believe our uniform regs have ever been as strict as the USN regs are.

Now, what is the reason or justification for not allowing sailors to wear the NWU off base?
Why does the Navy brass have such a problem with this? If not the NWU, can you guys change into a Navy PFT uniform and then proceed off base?

Thanks, J.

12/18/2008 1:51 PM

Anonymous steve cpo ret said...

Dunno Guys. I think there still much to be said for the old school dungarees. They were all cotton. One could get out of them pretty quickly if need be. If they caught fire, they were not as toxic as the polyester blends, etc. Same was true for the old cracker jacks (wool or gabardine).

12/18/2008 2:37 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Zumwalt got all this uniform change stuff started in the early 70's taking away crackerjacks and white hats and putting E6 and below in bus driver uniforms. I was COB on SS-580 in 74-75 when the official shift went into effect. Instead of being able to turn crackerjacks inside out, fold up and stow in a bunk locker, now had to find room for hanging up 60 + sets of bus driver uniforms. I converted two large deck gear stowage lockers into hang-up lockers in berthing. Put one of two enlisted showers OOC and converted it into deck gear stowage locker. What stupid BS!!!

CNO Holloway put enlisted sailors back into crackerjacks in early 80's as best I can recall. However instead of restoring the Undress blue and white jumper as a day working uniform he left E-6 and below in a blue wool CPO shirt, necktie and white hat!! Dumb!!

In 1974 the old double breasted dress white CPO uniform and the Khaki uniform, (blouse, long sleeve khaki shirt, black necktie, and brown shoes) went bye-bye. Now khaki's are back!!

All these uniform board people ought to be fired!!! Instead of trying to make sailors feel good with a uniform change Navy senior leadership oughta stop the "intrusive leadership" and treat sailors like adults. Based on my "unofficial morale survey" conducted with former enlisted sailors I've met stateside and some AcDu in Sasebo and Guam earlier this year, that would do a lot more towards improving attitudes about serving in todays Nav.

My two cents, and keep a zero bubble.....


12/18/2008 2:54 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Great points all around. Two things to add. First, has anyone priced out the 'great gortex jacket'? You're going to drop about $300 when your done. How is that good after getting paint on it. Second, with all the service uniforms (black and tans, dress khaki) when will they freaking figure out that most of us live in a climate when a damn long sleeve shirt would be useful in the winter. So we end up with everyone wearing their jackets indoors looking stupid. Put me in charge....

12/18/2008 9:54 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anyone got the CNOs, CNP and who ever elses email addresses? Maybe we can start a email campaign to get rid of ridiculous uniforms!

I remember when they started the Task Force Uniform and who the CMC was. I made the comment to a few others who knew who the CMC and they all agreed. It was going to be a clusterf***.

Thank goodness I retired this year! Now I don't have to dress idioticly.

I wanna know, what Sailor or Officer owns stock in the uniform company?!?!?!?

12/19/2008 12:39 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

NWU, new uniforms and a Navy Ethos. Hell, what else can those deskjockeys come up with to waste more Sailors time?????

I think there needs to be a cleansing of all rates and officer corps...time to clean out the deadwood!

12/19/2008 12:40 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

A navy uniform history lesson from the old chief Torpedoman (Submarines) in Weaverville CA.

The enlisted Navy uniform was pretty much stable from the end of WWII until early-Mid 70's when Zumwalt put enlisted sailors in bus driver uniforms. it's been a mess since then.

There was a time up until the early 70's when we still took pride in wearing a uniform ashore both in CONUS and Overseas. Contrary to urban legend or, is it Navy legend, US Navy sailors got respect and the girls loved us when in uniform. The Viet Nam war changed a lot of that and Zumwalt responded by allowing civi's ashore by everyone.

My pereception(based on my own unoffical morale survey) is USN enlisted Sailors today are not proud of their service or the uniform. today it's just a job, with another big bonus check for those fortunate enough to be in the right billet, specialty, or whatever. There is no pride today in being attached to a specific boat or ship and wearing the ships patch on the right shoulder and the "E" on the right sleeve (I know, today it's another geedunk ribbon) because the uniform is rarely worn ashore.

CO'S talk about the importance of the ships and the Navy's mission, however there's a disconnect when the sailor slips into civi's to go ashore. In years past competition between boats and ships had a lot to do with the wearing of the uniform. Believe me when I tell you a lot of that pride has to do with wearing of the uniform ashore, and the recognition that the sailor gets ashore for belonging to the US Navy.

There is something honorable about going ashore in uniform with your shipmates. Finding that civilians recognize your service, want to talk to you, and buy you a drink. Girls are attracted to sailors in uniform, particularly submarine sailors because they sail in dangerous waters. In years past, wearing the uniform ashore created fierce competition between boat crews and skimmers. We all pulled together against the skimmer pukes. We took a lot of pride in being submariners. We had our own watering holes where skimmers were not allowed. Thats all lost today. Leadership is more interested in passing the ORSE and keeping below the "libety incident" radar screen of C7F than creating a ships "Esprit de corps".

Sailors today still "pull liberty and go ashore" together. I've seen it in Guam, Sasebo and Yokosuka over the past year. yet to my eyes, somethings missing. It's the connection to the boat/ship and the Navy that comes with wearing the uniform ashore.

I don't believe that USN sailors in uniform become a "target" for problems anymore than a USN sailor in civi's do in WesPac. a Gaijin is still a gaijin.

My two cents and keep a zero bubble......


12/19/2008 11:20 PM

Blogger Bigbill said...

The rollout for the west coast is January 2010. My retirement may be around mid 2012 so I have to buy the uniforms for 18 months. Maybe I'll just wear my dress blues for every function that doesn't allow coveralls. The jacket should be good for cutting firewood in my retirement.

12/20/2008 8:45 PM

Anonymous exmspnavet said...

To DBFTMC(SS)USNRET, in many ways, you're right. I am an active duty sailor and you are both right, and wrong, about sailors not having pride in today's Navy or our uniforms. Now, I have only been in in for five years, but I have seen both the very best of the submarine fleet, and the very worst. I saw my last boat go from a morale-destroying cesspool that I hated to even have my name associated with, to a place where the crew had pride in their ship and pride in eachother, and pride in their Navy. The primary issue isn't the uniform itself in many ways. It is what that uniform means to the sailor who wears it. If you believe that your ship and your Navy are in fact something to be proud of, it shows. It shows in your attitude, your uniform, and everything you do. On my last boat, the MSP, I watched it go from a place where the crew absolutely hated (due to bad leadership) to a place that the crew loved and had pride in. When sailors are actually happy with where they are and with what they're doing, it shows. For a long time, I admit that I was not by any means proud of my ship or crew or the Navy that allowed it to be so bad. It is hard to be proud when you are treated like an expendable tool or garbage because the command is worried more about their next promotion and not the crew. But things changed, and for the better. We finally got some much needed leadership, in the form of COB Higgins (RIP), and he and the CO changed things for the better. They helped turn that boat into something we could all be proud of. They gave us something to believe in. They brought back deckplate leadership, in more than just name. They actually made the crew feel like we OWNED the boat, and we actually cared about what happened to it and eachother because we felt empowered. That is what makes a sailor have pride in his service and his uniform. Feeling like he or she acutally makes an appreciable difference. That he or she is actually a SAILOR, out there doing the job that sailors are supposed to be doing and not an expendable tool. Many sailors, unfortunately, only see the hind-end of the Navy. A lot only see poor leadership, petty boat politics, Navy policies and procedures that seem to be written by idiots (Like the NWU wear rules), and shipmates and leadership who are only out there to "play the game" and get that paycheck every couple weeks. That's not a lot for those poor sailors to be proud of, is it? The Uniform represents the Navy. A sailor who is actually proud of his ship, his crew, and his Navy will show it and wear their uniform with pride. The ones who don't give a damn will show that too.

12/22/2008 1:14 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I have always maintained that the uniform identifies your branch of the service to the public. It therefore has to be distinguishable from other services or uniform wearing occupations by the tradition of the service (USMC), or some other uniform item (like white hat). My sister could not recognize someone as a sailor when he was wearing his working blues (johnny cashes) with the black pisscutter. "What a funny outfit that young man is wearing!" At least the army and "chair force" can be differentiated by the green and blue colors respectively.

These NWU are a travesty, and just plain disgusting. I recall when the Navy had everyone wearing the double breasted jackets and garrison caps. Who could tell they were a sailor? Maybe if you looked close enough to the emblem on the cap where it had "US Navy" written on it. They were as much of a disaster as these NWU are shaping up to be. There's also a practicality issue. These NWU trousers have to be bloused. This takes a minute or two to do it sloppy. What if there's a casualty? Has anyone given a thought to damage control response time if everyone is blousing up their trouser legs? Doubtful.

Nobody likes this idea, but if it were up to me, I'd bring back the undress blues, and the traditional dungarees and ballcap. I'm sure with all our technology today we could come up with a durable, comfortable, easy-to-care-for uniform. Then, just hold the sailors accountable in keeping them squared away looking when they wear them off base. I like the coveralls for underway (or doing dirty work), of course.

Why is that so hard? Why does the brass have to reinvent the wheel? Rhetorical questions...


12/22/2008 11:51 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...


There is absolutely nothing that can top being on a great boat with an outstanding crew. I'm glad you got to see and experience the turn around on your boat!! BZ!! I know you hated your early experience, however you learned a hell of a lot about how to survive with crappy bosses.

My "unoffical and unscientific data collection" was done primarily in Sasebo which is home to a large Amphib group with a one star in charge, and on Guam with AS-40 and "Big Navy." these guys and gals are not submariners. Without a doubt my unscientific data left me with the impression that many sailors there dislike the Navy, and their ship(s) and can't wait to get out. Having them buy new uniforms ain't going to help. IMO, treating sailors like adults and

scuttling "intrusive leadership" would do a hell of a lot more for morale than giving them a new uniform and all the hastle that will result with figuring out how and when to wear it. all it's going to do is take the focus off the real morale problems that exist in 7th Fleet.

My two cents and keep a zero bubble.....


12/22/2008 8:44 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

They wouldn't have to worry about me wearing that uniform for stops off base-I wouldn't be caught dead in the ugly POS. I'd gladly lose whatever time it takes to change in and out of civvies for the commute.

Happy to be retired when I see crap like this.


12/22/2008 10:08 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fellas, I just want to point out a few things from the message. First sailors can still wear this piece of crap to and from work, just no stops.
More importantly though for those of you that think it was invented by some skimmer admiral, or a never going to sea shitbird, it wasn't. Task force uniform is chaired by a Mr. Robert Carroll. His title a few years ago was YNCM(SS) Robert Carroll. So try and figure this out, a submariner giving us the worst possible replacement uniform, not somebody that hasn't been to sea. But a guy that has been there. Its a head scratcher to be sure.

12/23/2008 9:27 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here's another peev of mine about the NWU. The name, and hence the acronym is difficult to say. I know that sounds weird, but consider how the acronym BDU comes off as efficient when pronounced becasue the sounds from one letter to the next are more natural transitions in language. NWU is unnatural sounding. Saying the N does not leave you naturally ready to pronounce the W, and then following with the U is like going backwards to try again, like a stutter. It's official; I hate EVERYTHING about the NWU.


12/23/2008 10:23 AM

Anonymous ET2 said...

I do have to agree about the stupidity of the uniform changes. What is with the brass that can't keep things simple? It would be easy to keep it to a nice, simple set of uniforms- coveralls, dark and tans (since it uses many of our current items, plus it is very sharp), and dress blues? And since we have boots out that you don't have to polish, why not just use them on and off ship?
Exactly how hard is it for someone to do things simply? The Marine Corps, for whom I worked with for a year in Iraq can, why can't we?

12/23/2008 12:54 PM

Anonymous Annoyed Sailor said...

Doing things simply doesn't require the Navy to spend hideous amounts of money, to make some contractor that gets to manufature the uniforms rich. The more uniforms we go through, the more money somebody's making. I wonder what, if any, connection exists between the people on the Task Force Uniform or their supervisors and the contractors supplying these very expensive, and utterly useless unifroms... Wait... hideously expensive and utterly useless or unneeded products and millitary contractors... that explains it all!!!

12/23/2008 7:45 PM

Blogger Rob said...

I'm SOOOOO glad I'm out. I thought the (admittedly minimal) restrictions on dungarees (later utilities) were stupid, and these are even worse.

In Hawaii the local DMV was in the Pearl City mall. It never failed, of our two cars they would forget to mail the renewal for one of them, requiring a trip in person to the DMV. What I found annoying and rather ironic is I'd often be in line with Air Force, Army, and Marine personnel in their everyday working uniforms, which were perfectly legal for wear in this setting. Me, I'd be proudly wearing my shorts, tshirt, and flip-flops (Hawaiian service dress), as MY everyday working uniform was not deemed acceptable for wear outside the base or my local gas station. When we switched from (the admittedly fugly) dungarees to utilities that was SUPPOSED to change. Utilities were supposed to be "street" acceptable...but in reality it didn't change a damn thing.

Now Sailors will be wearing nearly identical working uniforms as the Marines, Airmen, and Soldiers in that same DMV line, but the Sailor will be the one getting his ass chewed by his Chief for wearing an unauthorized uniform off base....when it's THE SAME UNIFORM as the Marine standing in line behind him, or the Airman in front of him. Just how damn stupid can the Navy brass get? And why does the Navy, of all services, have such idiotic rules (mainly targeted at it's enlisted personnel)? As a former blueshirt, this sort of mentality is what drove away a lot of good, intelligent, capable sailors...the overriding attitude Navy leadership had that somehow we could not be trusted to be "grown-ups" until we wore khaki (or maybe, if we were REALLY good, they'd consider us big boys at PO1).

It was much different (and much better) on subs, but "big Navy" clung to that attitude so tightly it was sickening.

12/24/2008 2:32 PM

Blogger Viperslate said...

Good Job Navy! Bring this uniform in and be so ashamed of it that we cant wear it anywhere. I was looking forward to being proud of my cammies and not be scared to go out in town and show it off, now will have to "hide" it. God forbid you need gas on the way to work and have to feel like a criminal pumping gas just waiting for some asshole to try to call you out on it. No one will wear this then. Already coming home in the utilities you are on the phone "sorry honey, I can't stop by the store, I'm in utilities, I have to go home and change first and then go back out" That's why people just come and go in civies and change at work already. This story will just piss you off thinking about it but, I for some reason am not surprised when I think about it.

12/31/2008 9:47 PM

Anonymous GREENEgoblin said...

I have been around awhile and I have worn nearly every uniform the Navy has rolled out over the past three decades. To qualify my statements, as a COB I have just received two sets of NWU’s, and a parka, at a cost of 450.00. – I’ll get to that later. I agree with most the old timers that the best working uniform was the much maligned Dungarees. Which were, by the way, the same exact uniform you were issued if you were in prison. They were cheap, the more faded they were, the more salty you were, you could write your name on them, iron on your crow, and best of all, you could tell who the dumbasses were because they misspelled their own name or left the little dotted lines on their iron on crow…or even ironed it on the wrong arm.
When the utility uniform came out the cost of the working uniform DOUBLED. The surface Navy then discovered coveralls “poopie suits” and they were ruined as well. I think the cost of a fully outfitted set of coveralls went to somewhere north of fifty dollars. The coveralls are comfortable, but not durable, and it should only be an underway uniform. Boats in Norfolk had Duty Chiefs and Topside Watches wearing that thing. Are you kidding me? Not on my boat. Both uniforms were not durable to work in, and cost too much too maintain. And, the Navy made about as many unenforceable rules on the coveralls on when and where and who that I did not allow them as an inport uniform on my boat, and I still will not.
When I arrived for my COB tour in 2003 I found my boat, somewhat in BDU’s, somewhat in utilities, and somewhat in coveralls. We went to all BDU’s . We supplied everyone with two sets when they reported (This didn’t always work, and some Sailors paid out of pocket which was never my intention and which I still regret). We deployed with them as our working uniform- and wore them until 2005 when they were axed as a submarine uniform by FORCE Master Chief Dean Irwin. I had my chiefs get their guys the heavy green coveralls from servemart to wear during maintenance so the guys didn’t ruin their utilities.. CHOP didn’t want to, but he did the right thing.
Now we have this uniform. The Parka is $170.35 with out the $57.20 fleece liner ($227.55). The blouse is $37.20 and the pants $39.00. Still ends up pretty expensive, add the patches and sewing and you are up to $92.80 per set plus sewing ($5.00 a patch x 6?).- And all of this by the way, doesn’t include the 9” black boots that cost $120.00 at the exchange. 9” is the key here…most black steel toe boots are 8”. At least they seem as durable as the $40.00 set of dungarees I came in the Navy with. As far as the price, EVERY Sailor got an increased uniform allowance to offset the cost. I am positive that MCPON West will do the right thing and unf*ck the uniform regs for wear to be at least as flexible as our old utilities and wash khakis.
I have seen the new service dress for E-6 and below, the black and tan, and it will be a much better uniform than the service dress whites, or the Johnny Cash. Both were a pain in the ass. I think the Navy got that one right, and perhaps it will become, like our khakis, a uniform they will be proud of wearing.
To the bonehead that decried “ECONOMIC CRISIS” and actually used the phrase “Effect change” , you are off your chart. The NWU is made in the USA at least, by Goodwill Industries, and seems to be well constructed. We were compensated for the cost of the uniform as stated previously. I just have to concentrate now on prepping my crew to wear it properly, planning for the cost, and preserving the uniforms they have now until they roll out the new ones. Hawaii doesn’t get this NWU uniform until summer of 2010.

1/03/2009 12:23 PM

Blogger jonseagull said...

Looking forward to my new duds. Personally, I am convinced that there is nothing more than retired master chief mafiosos running the scam of continuous (and crappy) new uniforms. BUT:
-Navy changed core values to mimic the marines when the marines would not change theirs.
-Navy shifts to uniforms that look like marines.
-Navy shifts uniforms that look like everyone else (blue cammy so we can hide when we fall overboard)

Looks like the upper levels are trying to -appear- relevant because they can't sell what we do. Bad news for me.

I go out and mix it up with [redacted] and I wonder if anyone knows...or cares...outside of my own little wonderful community. At least we can still buy a few new ships. Better than the SWOs.

1/03/2009 11:13 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...


Some of us CPO's were still wearing dungarees underway on Diesel boats as late as 1975. dungaree trousers and shirt, khaki belt, brown shoes. this uniform was authorized by Uniform Regs for CPO's and officers on submarines during the 20's. Don't know if it's been rescinded, although probably doesn't matter at this point.


1/06/2009 2:04 PM

Anonymous CTT1 said...

I love this "no one will find us if we fall overboard" comment. Stupid. The utilities and coveralls are blue too jackasses! I personally will love being able to wear the NWU! I hate the utilities because they are very uncomfortable when working shipboard, they get fouled easily and they just look horrendous! You retired "old salts" that are bitching about the new uniforms, stow it, you wont be wearing it anyway. The NWU is not intended to "hide" dirtbag Sailors who wont take care of ANY uniform you give them, nor is it intended to camoflauge us on the ships. The idea is too save Sailors money by not having to replace ruined utilities every other week. Yes, it will hide dirt and paint better, but that is so the uniform does not become unserviceable. Every ship I have been on does not allow us to wear coveralls in port. When you are doing PMS and the like, utilities do tend to get ruined. If i have a uniform I can wear that wont need to be replaced because of a small grease stain, then I have saved money. I like the choice. The tighter restrictions on wear off base? Well, i dont agree with that. The idea when they first started this whole NWU concept was to give us a uniform that could be worn while running errands and such. I feel like I got shafted there.

1/07/2009 6:10 PM

Anonymous CTT1 said...

I love this "no one will find us if we fall overboard" comment. Stupid. The utilities and coveralls are blue too jackasses! I personally will love being able to wear the NWU! I hate the utilities because they are very uncomfortable when working shipboard, they get fouled easily and they just look horrendous! You retired "old salts" that are bitching about the new uniforms, stow it, you wont be wearing it anyway. The NWU is not intended to "hide" dirtbag Sailors who wont take care of ANY uniform you give them, nor is it intended to camoflauge us on the ships. The idea is too save Sailors money by not having to replace ruined utilities every other week. Yes, it will hide dirt and paint better, but that is so the uniform does not become unserviceable. Every ship I have been on does not allow us to wear coveralls in port. When you are doing PMS and the like, utilities do tend to get ruined. If i have a uniform I can wear that wont need to be replaced because of a small grease stain, then I have saved money. I like the choice. The tighter restrictions on wear off base? Well, i dont agree with that. The idea when they first started this whole NWU concept was to give us a uniform that could be worn while running errands and such. I feel like I got shafted there.

1/07/2009 6:10 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The nwu's will be nice. Already getting the b&t's in california, I got a couple sets and ditched the blues/whites, they're quite nice. Now the nwus? I could give a shit either way. BDU-type uniforms are damn comfortable and durable, and note, it's meant to be the primary SHORE uniform while coveralls will still be in service underway. Personally the ashore regs are bassackwards, but it's the navy, what do you expect?


1/13/2009 6:16 PM

Anonymous ELT1(SS) said...

I’m just going to submit an amusing side note here.

I’m a Submariner that is currently stuck in the surface fleet.
In case your wondering…the surface fleet is completely different from the submarine force… in the fact that nothing the Skimmers do here makes any sense to me.

Anyway… I digress. The Senior Officers and Enlisted personnel (along with some blue shirts with nothing better to do) actually put Military Creases into their poopie suits?!?!?!? Why???

I like the new working uniform. I think it will look more militant than the current Utilities which make the wearers look like they should work at a Jiffy Lube or should be pushing a mop at the local High School.

I say Bring on the NWU!!!!! Unfortunately I’m stationed in Guam… so I won’t get to see till late 2010.

I don’t like the Black and Tan uniform… Khaki should be reserved for Officers and Chiefs.

Very Respectfully

1/26/2009 6:20 AM

Anonymous andy said...

Want to state first and foremost, that i am a marine and just happened to come across this blog when looking up how to acquire the NWU as a favor to my fiancee, who happens to be in the navy.

A comment that i found quite amusing:
ET2 said= The Marine Corps, for whom I worked with for a year in Iraq can, why can't we?
-how often do you hear that coming from the navy about the marine corps?

Good and bad points have been made but want to put forth my personal experience and observations that i have had/seen with cammies:

Have been wearing cammies now for over 2 years, have seen how well it stands up to the test of time and have seen marines that make it through entire enlistments with the same cammies they were issued in boot camp. As well, have proven as well that they can hide 85% of stains. Another point, the uniforms will look sharper than uniforms that the navy currently have. A last point that i will put forth about the cammies, they don't have to be tailored for every inspection that comes along. Are tailored straight from the get-go and for the most part don't need to be replaced unless body weight changes significantly. That is the one note that is bad about cammies: once too big or too small, have to get the same number of sets to replace them but from what i have seen and heard of, doesn't happen that often.

On a side note, have seen the new black/tan uniforms, think that if worn in the right professional manner, that they can help the navy's image in a good way. And considering the fact, these show rank insignia just like the NWU's. And to be frank, if was required to wear them wouldn't have any problems doing so.

To the points that i have seen and have read for myself in the Navy Times that i don't agree with: despite the promises from early on that the restrictions would be tightened even more than they already were. Standard boneheaded thinking that is most times associated with the military. And of course the leadership not taking pride in the NWU, if they have put their stamp of approval on it, allow the sailors that will have to wear them to feel proud of them and not destroy that because of the threat to their security. Air Force and Army haven't had a problem with it, why would the navy?

To finish want to send out thanks to the ones that stood out the most to me as i was reading through it.

To CTT1, thanks for the good points that you made and blunt points made in rebuttal to bad points.

To Greengoblin, for your continued posts of how things should be done and good points as well. I wish that my fiancee could serve in your command under you.

2/17/2009 6:26 PM

Anonymous Jabber said...

Thanks andy, so when are you sending me those nwu???....

if you cant guess i'm the soon to be wife to the marine that just spoke.

as for b&t, i would much rather wear those than the utes, in every watch but one that i have had since i've gotten them i've worn them. they are not the most comfy of the uniforms *coveralls are...* but other than they make all females look preggers *pregnant females wear there shirt untucked...* and we seem to be copying the marines, i dont have a problem with them.

as for the new camies *i'm not calling them nwu* i cant wait to wear them, i love the marine version, they are comfortable, hard to mess up. as for blousing the pants, have you ever tried, andy can do a good job in less than 30 seconds, it takes me a little less than a minute because i'm out of practice. My dad wore cami's in the army, i am going to be proud to wear camies on a reg basis, even if its not the same ones. finally the navy is letting us wear camies other than security.

To me, the b&t's got rid of two working uniforms, the cami's get rid of the utes and i guess the coveralls??? so that 2 new uniforms to replace 4 old ones? how is this bad? thats less maintance. only bad for the females because its all new stuff for us, no reusing the working blues, but thats only a problem for the people who have to replace them, not the new people coming in.
I'm in a squadron, I'm going to the boat very soon. I'm glad that people are voicing there opinion of the uniforms but remember not everybody feels this way.

to end this babbling,


So remind yourself that next time you look in the mirror and dont like what you see, its a contract, you can get out of it when your time is up.... Until, make the most of it.

2/17/2009 9:01 PM

Anonymous CaptSquid said...

I had the misfortune of enlisting just after Zumwalt changed the familiar seabag from dungarees and jumpers to Chief Suits and utilities. Try stowing THOSE onboard a boomer! The lockers on subs aren't known for their spaciousness and there was NO hanging space for the Dress Blues.

Then, we had to suffer through the Dreaded Salt-n-Pepper uniforms.

Later, before my third hitch, the PTB decided to change back to dungarees and jumpers -- WITH ONE EXCEPTION. The Undress Whites were 100% Polyester! Shades of Polyester Liesure Suites and the Double-Knit uniform fiasco of the mid 70s. Hot and unbreatheable in the summer, they yellowed when washed by the SHs. Throw in the satin modesty panels in the trousers and the ability to snag on virtually everything and you begin to wonder who's running the uniform shop.

Now? The Trop Whites and the Winter Working Blue uniforms are now replaced by a khaki-shirted version of the Salt-n-Peppers and coupled with a black fore-n-aft cover. They STILL look terrible and completely NOT Navy!

The old utility uniforms we were issued in Zumwalt's day were quickly tossed in favour of store-bought dungaree uniforms, which were more comfortable no matter what the season. That, and cotton doesn't burn or melt like the utilities.

Take that through phases of various iterations of the utility uniforms, they finally ended up in a poopy-suit version for all hands. Yeah, right. I remember poopy-suits with fondness, velcro and all. Now they've gone to the Navy's version of camouflage.

Hide oil and paint stains? Please! Those were the marks of a working sailor. Even wash khakis were not immune to the stains.

The Navy has never been one for spit-n-polish. But at least they're finally trying to achieve the uniformity that once existed in the 40s and 50s.

5/19/2009 2:19 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I have read through all these post and I have come to one conclusion. You are in the Military do what you are told to do and quit bitching about it. If you don't like it get the F out! I do not like that we are not allowed to wear the NWU off base and the higher ups need to rethink this but I will do what I am told to do and so should you.

6/14/2009 12:28 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I've been in for a few years, and have been required by various commands to wear dungarees, utilities, cammies (both woodland and desert) and all the other uniforms in between.
My primary issue with the NWU's is the color. It would seem that originally the uniform was on its way to being a practical uniform that could be pushed into tactical work, and the sleeve pockets on the NWU blouse seem to follow with the tactical side of used to be pretty routine to see guys cut off the bottom pockets of their cammie blouse and stitch them onto the sleeves, simply because the chest and waist pockets are inaccessible while wearing body armor and or a tactical vest.
Then the common sense seems to fade away; when TFU was designing the uniform there was an argument that the pattern should differentiate Sailors from Soldiers and Marines, so they To imagine I used to think camouflage was to make someone LESS visible, rather than make a fashion statement.
I will buy them (not much choice...) they are by most accounts very comfortable (even more so than regular cammies) and durable.
Too bad someone's teenage club-going child apparently chose the color or it would make a lot more sense (to me).
This is all of course, without even addressing the issue of wear off base...I suspect that Navy top brass still hasn't let go of the old culture of enlisted men being little more than forced laborers under the Naval aristocracy of the Officer corps. I'm sure there are some that still think of the enlisted man as uneducated and untrustworthy, perhaps someone best motivated by beating with the flat of a sword...and the official uniform policies have seemed to reflect this for some time. It is definitely more "us/them" in the Navy as compared to other services which are more of a "one team" mentality.
The NWU's also (yes they're all blue) really do blend with water far better even than dark blue coveralls. From a SAR standpoint...not a good idea to be stuck in those when risking the drink.
Just my opinion, anyway.

6/15/2009 9:01 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Policy change for wear to/from work: NAV ADMIN 188-09. Routine stops ok. Still hate color, but at least they are work comfortable than what we have now.

7/19/2009 8:58 PM

Anonymous SeabeeMainah said...

Blue Digital Cammis look fucking ridiculous, seeing as all the "A-Schoolers" here at CBC Gulfport are walking around around all fuckered up. 8-Points pulled down like a fucking ball cap, looking like a bunch of Pier Queers. Now, Digital Deserts and Greens, that would be a better move, seeing as how our BDU's are outdated as all holy hell. Hell, just give us the MARPAT unifroms and replace the EGA with our BEE. You know if Higher decides to outfit the Bees in a new Digital Cammi, then they'll be like... you have to have the ACE on it... fuck it...

9/17/2009 11:32 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Now that the NWUs and Service uniform are gospel and only a few are not wearing the, now there's an issue with the NWU boots. I keep hearing about how bad the new boots are, but EVERYONE has to have a pair. WTF happened to JUST needing a black, steel-toe, all leather, no spark, oil resistant, 9" boot?

According to NAVADMIN 271-09, flight deck crews can use their old boots and keep wearing them, but STILL have to have one of the new sets? I'll agree with several other posters on that someone has stock in the uniform companies.


9/25/2009 5:59 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Oh and the "ACE" reminds me of the "EGA" that the Marines wear complete with it's own 3-letter acronym. It's quite embarassing when the Navy is instituting Marine tradition into "

It's also pretty sad that the Navy will be allowed to wear a uniform that even resembles the Marine Corps... Why in the hell do squids need camo anyway???

11/15/2009 12:33 PM

Anonymous AO1(AW)JMM said...

All you retired A holes need to STFU and GTFO cause your opinion does not matter. as for those of you that dont like the uniform you all can go to hell because there was a survey that you SHOULD have participated in and would have been able to post your opinion on. I for 1 am glad this uniform is here as it is a whole lot better than the dungarees and the utilities.

2/05/2010 7:28 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...


2/16/2010 9:39 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Been in since 1990; I have survived three different working uniforms. I filled out the comment section on Task Force Uniform. Said we should go back to dungarees. Great uniform. An Airman could go to the NEX and leave with a complete uniform for less than $20. Technology being what it is, a more colorfast denim could easily be found. Ignored. Also suggested a return to the old WW2 era canvas undress whites. Ignored too. We have us a Navy bent on destroying its heritage, and about the only thing that MIGHT turn things around is a full-tilt shooting war. The brass would figure out pretty quick this NWU isn't fit to wear on a flight line. For my part, I'm glad I retire soon. Ain't been the same Navy since Tailhook, ADM Boorda's death and puttin chicks on WARSHIPS.

3/22/2010 8:53 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yep, you should retire. If you can't handle change I wonder how you made it this far.

4/09/2010 5:37 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

AO1: Have you *ever* been in a squadron? If you were, were you a PC? Your comments lead to the belief you haven't; if you HAD, you would realize the only time of year the NWU is tolerable out on the line/on the roof is WINTER or a mild day in helos. Jets+ summer+ NWU= heat stroke. Hopefully, the brass will WAKE UP and either 1) come out with a summer weight NWU 2) Authorize utes and boots to launch and catch or 3) admit the mistake and go back to good old dungarees. About the only common sense in this whole travesty has been the belated authorization to wear comfortable, FOD-resistant boots with the Nearly Worthless Uniform.

4/11/2010 12:55 PM

Blogger kellver said...

I am ET2(SW) Mills. I have served at sea and ashore. The NWUs have proven to be durable over time. They are hard to tear and take much longer than the utilities to wear out. Color is barely faded after 100+ washes. They make small stains impossible to notice. I had to replace my utilities every year because they would tear, fade, and get a stain and be unSAT. I've had my NWUs for 3 years now and have not had to replace them yet. As for the boots, it makes sense. If the rough out boots get scuffed/gouged (which will happen at sea) they look awful. The sea duty approved boots can be shined to look good even if they are beat to all hell. The only bad thing is the 8 point cap. I've lost 3 off a windy deck already I absolutely loathe the covers.

1/29/2011 4:57 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

First off, I'm an old-timer. How old? Navy officers and chiefs wore a dress khaki uniform when I started out and I wore the old woolen Cracker Jacks. Every few years, someone somewhere feels the need to change the uniforms. Except for the point that wool costed them too much to continue making Cracker Jacks the old-fashioned way, I've never quite been able to figure our why. You used to be able to tell who was who a mile a way -- which service they belonged to, whether they were enlisted or officer. Not anymore. Now, "uniform" means they're trying to have us all look the same...without looking the same.

Camo's for seamen? Who are we hiding from on board ship with Zebra set? Somebody tell me! Oh, we're blending in, alright.

The old uniforms made sense. You wore a working uniform when you were getting dirty, a dress uniform when you weren't, when you were on watch or when you went ashore.

I don't know blouse straps from bra straps, but it seems I'm going to learn. Yes, that's right. As long as I've been around, I'm still a reserve officer. Last year, they made the coveralls a requirement. This year, NWU's are the cause for a visit to the Exchange.

Black and tans? I saw a kid wearing them during my last AT. I couldn't tell if he was a chief, a white hat or if he'd spilled coffee on his pants and the black pants were the only thing he had to wear. At least camo's rhyme. Black and tan is an alcoholic drink -- something I feel as though I'm getting pushed towards as I think about looking like a jarhead the next time I go on AT.

2/13/2011 3:48 PM

Anonymous Mike said...

Just like the military to create a uniform at the taxpayer's expense that neither resembles the service it; practicality or traditionally. Why are you Navy guys so scared of getting dirty that you feel the need to hide dirt? The world is not a parade deck, a parade deck is a parade deck. Go to work and get dirty.... please.... stop being little girls about it.

8/25/2011 9:01 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Several folks calling for action, but not one comment on a practical solution.

A couple of references to traditions and "when I was in the Navy"-themed comments, but no mention of how the uniforms evolved to that point prior to their military service.

A lot of use of words like "wasteful" and "failure" and even "disgrace", but none of them recognized that this was implemented at the request of the fleet for a practical uniform that would span working environments and time.

A few stories about individual situations (I work on an air field, I work in Hawaii, I work in a sub, etc), but no comments that consider the whole Navy outside of their little bubble.

1 or 2 comments about how silly it is to "blend in with the water" and the danger it creates if you go that line of thinking we'd have to all be constantly wearing bright orange uniforms. As an enlisted U/W OOD I can tell you that after a short distance it doesn't matter if you're wearing blue coveralls or digi-blue NWU's--you're difficult to locate either way. Or just don't go overboard...

From reading the almost 3 years of comments on this blog it's evident that the old addage is true: a bitching sailor is a happy sailor.

9/17/2011 11:06 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The powers that be actually search the internet to see if any NWU fabric or garments are sold and they contact the vendors to withdraw the item or face legal action.
The interesting side effect of this is to raise the total cost of the fabric since the fabric manufacturers are barred from selling the off-standard fabric in order to lower the total cost of production. That is, this added cost must be absorbed by the military.

11/27/2011 11:27 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

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5/30/2012 1:07 AM

Blogger Darci said...

I think the uniforms look sharp and are a lot better to look at than a prison uniform. Falling overboard would be a problem with any blue uniform. We were taught to take our pants off, tie the legs off, and fill with air to use as a floatation device. I hope the new ones work the same way. With the tech out there today, they need to have a small pack with a folded up vinyl orange vest with a CO2 cartridge and a strobe light.

8/15/2012 11:18 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

It's funny how much people hate change.

8/15/2012 5:53 PM

Anonymous Sabina said...

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9/05/2012 8:34 AM

Anonymous Edith said...

So, I do not really consider it may have effect.

9/05/2012 11:05 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Navy: Working Uniforms Extremely Flammable
Dec 16, 2012
Stars and Stripes | by Cristina Silva

NAPLES, Italy -- Navy working uniforms are extremely flammable and will melt in a fire, putting sailors at risk, the Navy announced Wednesday.
The nylon-and-cotton (referred to as NYCO) uniforms worn by sailors on ships and at bases “will burn robustly,” and turn into a “sticky molten material,” according to a test conducted in October by the Navy Clothing and Textile Research Facility.
“It will melt and burn to consumption,” Rear Adm. John Kirby, chief of information, said in a statement.
There have been no uniform requirement changes made after the finding. Navy officials said they are committed to sailor safety.
“Where there is a need, fire retardant/flame resistant clothing is provided,” Kirby said.
Under the textile flame resistance test, the uniform cloth was subjected to a flame for 12 seconds. Marine and Army uniforms made of rayon, para-aramid and nylon fibers were also tested, but only the Navy uniforms melted and were consumed by the flame, according to a report on the tests.

OSC USN Ret. (1983)

12/20/2012 1:21 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...


5/16/2013 7:51 PM

Blogger Zayne Carrick said...

I think the thought process of "They are in the middle of the ocean, what could go wrong?" is a dangerous path. I've taken a look at the Kansas city uniform rentals and noticed that all of their materials are very strong. As for the "Blue Cammies of death" I think the aesthetic look of them is completely appropriate.

6/04/2013 9:48 AM

Blogger Gary Heaton said...

By changing to this stupid "Blue Cammies" instead of having E-6 and below in dungarees and E-7 and above in khaki. Being former enlisted I could not wait to make Chief. That was one of the big things about making E-7. Now the navy looks just like every other service dressing everybody the same. The Navy used to stand out because of the way we looked. Everybody could tell we were in the NAVY. Not now we just look like every other service. Another tradition down the drain. So what ever bonehead committee thought this up needs to be fired. Bring back the dungarees and khaki and get rid of these crappy cammies.

3/30/2014 8:21 PM


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