Keeping the blogosphere posted on the goings on of the world of submarines since late 2004... and mocking and belittling general foolishness wherever it may be found. Idaho's first and foremost submarine blog. (If you don't like something on this blog, please E-mail me; don't call me at home.)

Friday, February 03, 2012

Where Have All The SUBRONs Gone?

Yesterday's disestablishment of Submarine Squadron 3 follows up last month's folding of SUBRON 2, with their assigned submarines being farmed out to SUBRONs 1, 4, and SUBDEVRON 12. If I'm counting right, we're back down to the same low number of Submarine Squadrons we had at the bottom of the drawdown in the late '90s.

"We're from Squadron and we're here to help" has always been an intentionally ironic statement among Submariners. Have you ever been in a situation where Squadron actually did help? I always liked how they could order sister submarines to give up parts to my boat, not so much the other way around...

[Non-related personal note: As I saw the date of this post, I realized that I was commissioned an Ensign 23 years ago today in Newport. Happy Anniversary to my fellow graduates of OCS Class 89001!]


Anonymous Cupojoe said...

Sounds like a good move to me. Whatever makes things less top heavy, the better.

2/03/2012 10:23 AM

Blogger Sandy Salt said...

I'm with Cupojoe on this one. The more brass we eliminate the better off we are. Has another Captain billet really helped make us better? I remember SUBRON 16 & SUBRON 20, both covering the four to eight boats at the time. One was responsible for off-crew and the other was an actual SUBRON. Not to say there weren't some good guys in 16, but talk about a waste of overhead.

2/03/2012 10:29 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Interesting. When I was in Pearl in the late 80's and early 90's, SUBRON 1, and 7 were the only sub squadron's there. CSS 3 must have been established after I left there. Also, Olympia was once attached to SUBRON 1. I had some good times at Squadron 7 TDY in the Ops Center. I learned to write OPORDS and had to ride P-3's on occasion out of the former Barbers' Point NAS.

2/03/2012 11:44 AM

Blogger Ret ANAV said...

Methinks this makes three times SUBRON 3 has come and gone in my lifetime. Just sayin'.

As far as "eliminating" brass...Believe it when I see it. More of a redistribution, methinks?

"I'm From Squadron, I'm Here to Help" has actually served me pretty well over the years, though it depends on the quality of CSS ANAV. -6, -8 and -22 when I was on USTA(TWIN)CITY were first-rate and had our backs. Earlier in my career, not so much, but didn't break my ba11$ either.

2/03/2012 12:03 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Speaking of OCS, since you commisioned, that too has made the round trip of the Newport/Pensacola split, to everything is Flordia, to everything in Rhode Island.

2/03/2012 12:49 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Now we just need to eliminate the Gru staffs. Never had any notion of what value they ever added to the Force except as cushy shore duty for some ppl with delusions of how much better they were than anyone else.

2/03/2012 12:59 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Eliminating subron staff billets allows the military to expand new commands while attaining reduced headcount goals overall.

Examples of regimes to be expanded (if our government can do what it tells us) are Navy SEAL Teams and the USMC's Cyberspace Command.

The writing had been on the wall for subrons since the advent of ADNS, C24ISR and TAD duty like BH once had on a CVN.

Such teamwork is destined to replace dedicated squadron work like critical parts/crew/vessel availability. Barely even battle tested yet, so how will it work?

Guy P.

2/03/2012 1:27 PM

Anonymous ComentGuy said...

Top heavy stuff never helps it only breaks things that are good and workable.

2/03/2012 3:43 PM

Anonymous CommentGuy said...

Officers and enlisted have a whole different view of this and there are more of them there are of you.

They make or break the service and you guys just ride on their works. Period end of story.

2/03/2012 3:54 PM

Anonymous LT L said...

@annon 1259

Don't the GRUs own the actual comms gear? At least at DEVRON 5 we didn't have the same antennas on our roof or watchfloor that SUBGRU 9 did.

The rest of the GRU, though: I have no idea what they did but hold the [REDACTED] tickets that the fast boat guys all got and the boomer guys didn't. And they collected a paychek; they did that really well.

- LT L

2/03/2012 7:29 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Squadron RCA (ETCM also the Squadron EDMC) sat my young 1st month as RCA Ensign butt down and trained me for a couple of hours. Some of the most enlightening hours of my 4 years on my boat.

2/04/2012 12:30 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Totally off topic, but wow:

2/04/2012 6:38 AM

Anonymous submarines once ... said...

Always operated with the philosophy of "Never pass up the opportunity to take a shot at the staff, cuz they won't pass on the chance to take one at you." And we all knew where we stood. But there was a place for the intermediary on occasion.
With the requirement for more officers to get joint annoited and thus less time at sea, there may be a need for more squadron intervention/oversight than in years past but I'm long gone from the active duty rodeo!

2/04/2012 8:03 AM

Blogger Sandy Salt said...

It appears that SONGS is having a tough week, first they have a leaking S/G tube that takes down the only operating unit and now some jackass falls in the pool. When it rains it pours.

2/04/2012 8:18 AM

Anonymous Carl said...

Falling in the pool ... wasn't the first time, won't be the last. Certainly not what you want happening (especially when pool temperature is above 110°F) but that's why there are life jackets and tie-offs. Heck, divers are often used in the pools ... with appropriate radiological controls, of course.

2/04/2012 8:41 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Don't the GRUs own the actual comms gear? At least at DEVRON 5 we didn't have the same antennas on our roof or watchfloor that SUBGRU 9 did."

Before consolidation, the GRU's were the SUBOPAUTHS (like CSG 7 stil is), therefore they ran the broadcasts and controlled waterspace for their AOR.

I.e. CSG 5 was SOCAL/NOCAL (CTG 14.6), CSG 9 was PNW (CTG 14.9). I assume the LANT was setup that way also.

That has since been consolidated at the CSP/CSL level.

As far as I tell, the GRU's now really only serve as local flag for the SSBN's on the west coast. They MAY also act as a backup BCA? Not sure how they are setup on the LANT or MED.

CSG 7 still opearates as before (CTF 74/54).

Jim C.

2/04/2012 9:06 AM

Anonymous LT L said...

@Jim C. Ret ANAV

That explains it; thanks!


2/04/2012 11:31 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Up until the mid 70's there was another layer of staff under submarine squadrons, submarine divisions. Each squadron had at least two divisions with their own staffs. They were disestablished in the mid 70's and were not missed.


2/04/2012 11:49 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I always liked when squadron came down during refit to look at Mdiv records. They told you were doing something wrong. You changed it to the way they said to do it and when ORSE came down they hit you on what you changed.
In reference to the squadron 16 and 20 situation at Kings Bay when they did that, As a squadron commander, if you can not look out your window and see the boats something is wrong.

2/04/2012 1:57 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Not far away enough!

Micromanaging each boat and providing "No Value Added".

Endless distractions and projects getting in the way of actually executing the "Design For Submarine Warfare"

2/04/2012 5:37 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I had an excellent relationship with my Squadron QAO on the tender over in Holy Loch in the late 80's and early 90's. Probably due to the fact that I was permanently designated as the QAO on my boat so the Squadron QAO realized I was not going anywhere and actually worked with me. He actually sent me over to help out a fellow DCA on a sister boat that was tagged as the QAO and had not yet learned the tricks for survival...I guess the lessons learned came easier when it was from someone else on a boat rather than straight from Squadron.

But I do remember the day I yelled back at some Squadron clown who was complaining that we never answered the phone on the submarine when the Tender called. I explained to him the standing tradition that if no one answered the phone in the first 3 rings, no one was ever going to answer it. We had better things to do than to answer the fricking phone! If you wanted to talk to us, walk your happy ass down and talk to us! It was not like we were going anywhere!!

(Later I learned that I had been yelling at some LCDR on the Squadron staff...I was a pissed off LT(jg) with no sleep after a brutal EDO duty day who did not suffer the silliness of a Squadron clown and he bore the brunt of it...)

2/04/2012 6:37 PM

Blogger tennvol said...

Happy commissioning anniversary to you, too! Oddly enough, the weekly countdown on SiriusXM's 80's on 8 channel was from this week in 1989. I was wondering why I didn't remember so many of the songs, then it dawned on me that I checked out of pop culture starting September 30, 1988 when we reported to OCS.

2/04/2012 8:21 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

You know,
In over a quarter of a century of doing this bubblehead thing. I can only remember one Squadron type being genuinely helpfull. As a rule I usually don't name names here but I will in this case. Then FTBCS/SS Fred the man Perkins. We were in shock when he showed up in MCC. Not to give us a YFG speech but he would show up at least once a week and no shit would ask us what he could do to help. It wasn't what I was used to.
With respect to the Group, not really sure what they do for us other than being the ISIC designated RSPG ( Random Science Project Generator). They lost their Comms billets, I belive they were relocated to CSP so the Watch Floor will shut down soon. Heck I've called over for their Duty Officer to be told " He hasn't come in yet." So they really have no operational role. SQDRN does the cert and traing bit. Group doesn't do any scheduling or water space mangement stuff so not really sure what value they provide to us.

Since this thread was started about the SQDRN 3 standdown. Does anybody else remember what caused a prospective Commodore of this Squadron to have his change of command canceled and he was rerouted to the sand box?
I think he had some issue with taking pictures of Womens butts in the exchange. Though I wasn't there... I think his quote was " I have an ass fetish."

2/04/2012 10:20 PM

Anonymous mln84 said...

During a pre-inspection workup assist, a squadron weenie LCDR actually drew a grease pencil box on the floor of Radio and told me to stand in it, after we had argued what my job as communicator was during BSM. Idiot actually thought I was only supposed to ferry message traffic from the RM's to the EAM teams and then go back and wait for more. Told him would do my job as my CO had approved in all our drills, etc, and CO backed me.

2/04/2012 10:56 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wtf was going on up in Bangor last year? I just heard a COB was banging a female middie during some wild crew party?!? Was this the same COB fired for the classified material faux pas or a different one?

2/05/2012 9:30 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The "classified material" charge was the cover story to protect and give political cover for The Women At Trident (TWAT) experiment. Yes, same guy.

2/05/2012 10:28 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Middie Ass.... Nice move, glad to see there are still men in fleet......

2/05/2012 10:50 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Who was the P-Commodore that had his CSS3 orders cancelled and sent to the sand box?

2/05/2012 12:41 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Now here's the real question. How many of you sang the title of this post in David Lee Roth's voice?

2/05/2012 3:00 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anonymous @ 10:28 AM-great acronym-too bad it's the new reality in the PC sub force.

2/05/2012 3:06 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Joel: you might want to ask the group what their proudest moment was as a submariner. I think we could all use an inspiring moment or two...

2/06/2012 3:15 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Who needs an inspiring moment? Aren't we all inspired enough already!!!!

How about a "Design for Inspiration"

2/06/2012 6:08 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Got those Trident panties all bunched up in a knot again? That just has to be downright inconvenient.

2/06/2012 6:35 PM

Blogger Stacey said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

2/07/2012 3:55 AM

Blogger SJV said...

I guess it's better than banging the guy middie?

2/07/2012 5:38 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

This just proves that only a lower quality of woman joins the Navy. What kind of college girl fucks a smelly ass old senior chief whose other option is probably a chain smoking shamu who thinks she is a chief too.

2/07/2012 8:38 PM

Blogger Harold said...

That last comment is really cruel...

2/07/2012 9:47 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Actually, if you've met most Mrs. Chief's, I think it's fair to say I was being pretty generous.

2/08/2012 5:26 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...


Cruel? Yes.

Accurate? Mostly.

Proves the point: 'what kind of self respecting college girl would sleep with Dave Turley???' He is not a pretty man, not a fit man, not even a decent man. Always thought he was a bag of shit - now he's done us all a favor by proving it.

And to whoever posted "we still got men in the fleet" - giving some backhanded praise to this worthless ex-COB....really? Having sex is where you set the bar of manhood? Sounds like you're stuck at aboiur 14 years old.

2/08/2012 1:04 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

OT: But I heard through the grape vine that the 742G CO went to Admiral's Mast. Since his Change of Command was supposed to occur in a couple of weeks they quietly had the PCO relieve early with no band. The old CO was the submarine force's golden boy...the 1120 flags sure know how to pick'em

2/08/2012 5:54 PM

Blogger Mike Mulligan said...

That is both Songs 2 and 3 with premature wear, and the NRC a few weeks ago asking TMI why their new s/g tubes are wearing out way premature.

And Songs and TMI SG manufacturers are different...

Implies the engineering design and manufacturing codes are inadequate?

2/08/2012 6:21 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

No dumb-ass, it implies their chemistry maintenance is inadequate.

2/08/2012 7:25 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

742G? Was that Diego Hernandez? What did he do?

2/08/2012 7:40 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Looks like Diego has been a guest on TSSBP before:

Ps. Dirty Dave is not only fat and ugly, but, due to the close proximity of serving on a submarine, I will vouch that he is hung like a field mouse (i.e. it looks like a penis only smaller).

2/08/2012 7:57 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

re: 742G...

Major scandal. All on the waterfront have been told not to talk about it, even to each other. There is an ongoing investigation...

Look out for it in the Navy Times....

2/08/2012 8:52 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Guess who was driving drunk?

Guess who else was in the car, drunk?

Note: There is something special about the WYO that it only has in common with 3 other boats, all Ohio class that the Navy is trying to keep hushed...

2/08/2012 8:56 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

It seems everyone is hinting that women on subs is NOT working out. What is the fear of folks speaking their honest opinion? Multiple subs with two crews with women onboard - what is the fear that an anonymous post offering a glimmer of truth will cause, ninjas shooting darts through your car window?

2/08/2012 9:05 PM

Anonymous mark/MM1(ss) said...

@ anon@8:56 - this link would seem to indicate that you are talking out of your ass...

2/08/2012 9:53 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I don't get that either. It's not like any information on women ever on subs is classified. Did every AD submariner sign NDA's or page 13s or something? I don't even think the Navy could do anything to you if you posted here and then went to your boss and said, " hey, i posted a true story to stupid shall be punished"

What are they threatening? I imagine it's bullshit.

2/08/2012 10:05 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

(anon @ 905pm continued:) Regarding almost anything else in the Navy (that's UNCLAS), people on this board who are in a position to know have been pretty un-afraid to give their opinions/viewpoints on sensitive personnel issues.

I wish SOMEONE serving onboard with women would give the same honest opinion: the good, bad & ugly. Posted as 'anonymous', what's to fear? Big Navy is simply not smart enough or care enough to witch-hunt an 'anon' on TSSBP.

My prediction: its a big non-event. Submariners have managed to ground/collide/fuck-up for a century before women joined the submarine force and they will continue to ground/collide/fuck-up afterwards with & without women onboard.

2/08/2012 10:11 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The rumor I heard about the former golden boy is that his offense did not revovle around women in subs but just the same arrogant stupidity that he has been demonstrating since he was a midshipman. But I'm not on the waterfront so this is only a rumor.

2/09/2012 6:33 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

As far as why there is a lack of people posting all the bad things that are happening since we put women on subs - maybe it's not an information blackout - maybe there just ain't any?

Sometimes the simplest explanation is the correct one

2/09/2012 6:36 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

^^^Do you mean something like a COB banging a female middie and losing his job over it while she's separated from the USNA? Something juicy like that, perhaps?

And the drama has only just begun.

2/09/2012 10:53 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

P.S. As for the guys on the boats keeping quiet about the "under instruction" female officers that've been assigned to the T-hulls, my best advice is to continue to shut the hell up.

I've personally witnessed how Big Navy (or whatEVER) literally hovers over this blog to the point that an alleged Facebook pic of the COB & the middie (found via Google) was made to go away inside of 15 minutes. And that's a no-shitter. IMHO 'they' are way out of bounds to be engaging in behavior like that, but it wouldn't be the first time that the gov't apparatchiks got away with bad behavior.

In short, "Life is hard, but it's harder when you're stupid...and TSSBP."

2/09/2012 11:03 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

In other, non-Femalien news: the NRC has just approved two new nuke plants. This is the first time since 1978 that any new plant has made it past this hurdel.

2/09/2012 1:24 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

In regards to the original topic, I have received tons of help and good advice from my squadron counterparts over the years. As a current squadron weenie myself, my main goal is to do as much for the guys on the boats as my squadron guys did for me over the years...if I can do that, I'll certainly feel like I've suceeded.

As for CDR Hernandez showing up on TSSBP again...I guess Joel's blog is like a mom-and-pop restaurant, and thrives on repeat business.

I have neither the time or energy to really get into how I feel about Dirty Dave and the black eye he's given every Submarine Chief with his jackassery.

2/09/2012 2:50 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"...Dirty Dave and the black eye he's given every Submarine Chief with his jackassery."

Like many, MANY Americans these days, I hold the current set of politicians in D.C (in uniform and otherwise) in the lowest of regard.


What if this particular outcome of putting women on the boats is merely the unfolding of a completely expected set of circumstances...and, quoth the Animal House, "...all is well"?

Not that I would give the politicos the unearned benefit of the doubt for doing the right thing for once on purpose, but stop and think about it for a minute: putting women on boats would UNDOUBTedly cause some submarine seniors, officer and enlisted alike, to get into trouble. Given the -- let's be completely honest (think Olongapo) -- pre-existing situation of anything-but-reputable 'integrity' exhibited by many submariners, married and otherwise, wouldn't putting women on the boats serve as an excellent form of flypaper for catching the too-clever-by-half degenerates?

This might not be such a bad situation after all.

It's gonna take a while to sweep all the horseshit out of the barn, but there may be a pony in there after all.

Food for thought.

2/09/2012 3:32 PM

Anonymous NHSparky said...

Yup--there MAY be a pony in there. Or there may just be a lot more horseshit.

My take remains constant--I've no doubt that women can do the job of being a nuke, but IN THAT ENVIRONMENT is where the real issue lies. And frankly, submarines are too small and unplanned losses are too hard-hitting for months--years--after the fact to easily recover.

2/09/2012 4:02 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Perhaps. But since when has submarining, or unplanned people losses, been "easy?"

With the pig-in-a-python VA Class overmanning situation from not building as fast as planned, there's plenty of grist for the mill.

So...reality being the tenacious thing that it is...batter up! Who's next in line for the flypaper dance?

2/09/2012 4:23 PM

Anonymous Stsc said...

"With the pig-in-a-python VA Class overmanning situation from not building as fast as planned, there's plenty of grist for the mill.". Not in the enlisted ranks. We are still undermanned in almost every submarine rating. NMP continues to drop in multiple areas and pay grades because inventory is still unable to support manning to BA.

2/09/2012 5:05 PM

Anonymous NHSparky said...

Anon @ 4:23--when I was in, one of the hardest slots to fill on a boat was SSN 3363 E-6. And it still is.

RC-Division going out to sea barely able to maintain a watchbill, but we're supposed to be worried about what the bean-counters think?

Even with the NNPS "pump not a filter" mentality, boats are having a hard enough time keeping manned, and by which I'm not talking your five or six-section inport duty. 3-section at BEST.

The ONLY thing that might be improving that scenario is the crap economy, but even then, no bad economy lasts forever. Couple that with the resurgence in nuclear power coming our way, and you're going to have a real issue even keeping 4 SSGN's, 10-12 SSBN's (as opposed to 14 currently) and 40-45 SSN's, along with 11 CGN's manned, women or not.

2/09/2012 6:04 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Dirty Dave" story just hit Navy Slimes:

Still haven't seen anything about 742G CO going to Admiral's mast...guess the 1120 flag's will keep it quiet so that Diego Hernandez can make 0-6. Was it just a coincidence that the mast was delayed until the 0-6 board adjorned?????

2/09/2012 7:18 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

nghsparky - you must have meant 11 CVN? Heard rumors of CGNs, nuke LHAs & others being mandated for any new construction, but don't think its gotten any serious traction yet. Personally, I would rather see our nation's nuclear talent & remaining industry focus on civilian plants than worry about bringing back CGNs, DDGNs, etc.

Seen some studies on nuke vs. fossil-fueled ships - the breakover point where nuke was more economical was ~$100/barrel for big-deck amphibs, maybe $150/barrel for small boys (give or take, depending on who you read). And I think those were with VERY favorable assumptions to support nuclear power!

(what was the original topic again???)

2/09/2012 7:18 PM

Anonymous NHSparky said...

Sorry--fat-fingered it. Damn bacon fingers.

Yummy, delicious, crispy, heavenly...what subject? Oh yeah--did you hear Jack in the Box is coming out with bacon shakes?

2/09/2012 8:42 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think the TSSBP blog and it's readers get a lot credit for breaking the Dirty Dave story. Goes to show that even Navy Times reads TSSBP!

2/09/2012 9:17 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Serious, albeit depressing question: noting that the COB was "administratively removed" in proper, pinky-extended terminology, is adultery now okie dokie in the USN as regards the UCMJ?

Since fudge-packing is now a 'choice' post-DADT, y'gotta wonder why adultery wouldn't be.

Separately, but related: if two gays get married in a state, and one of them screws around on the other one, are they guilty of adultery, sodomy or none of the above?

Just sayin'.

2/09/2012 9:30 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Serious, albeit depressing question: noting that the COB was "administratively removed" in proper, pinky-extended terminology, is adultery now okie dokie in the USN as regards the UCMJ?". Ask Capt Gero.

2/09/2012 10:56 PM

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2/10/2012 12:11 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...


The "Dirty Dave" story was just PURGED from Navy Slimes.

2/10/2012 6:22 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Looks like Navy Times has removed the "Dirty Dave" article...

2/10/2012 6:28 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Difffernt Topic - Looking for new job … and country?

Australia is recruiting US Navy Sailors.

2/10/2012 6:32 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hey, some good news for the men-in-black, tax-dollar-sucking-contractor, zero-national-defense-providing, waste-of-oxygen submarine blog watchers: I have a new challenge for you.

If you go to this link, you'll see that Google search STILL comes up with the gist of the Dave Turley story as (formerly) featured on Navy Times!

Oh happy day! Some new/old information to suppress from the ignorant masses!

Stop watch for the deletion of this is running....NOW. Step quickly now, you ball-licking public information parasites!

2/10/2012 8:08 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Y'know, come to think of it, I believe that I'll email the link for this thread to a few destinations that may have an interest in such sorts of political machinations.

Time to air things out a bit with the bright light of ever-greater public attention.

Nope...we're not China. Yet.

2/10/2012 8:30 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Too late. That story has been removed from the link listed above.

2/10/2012 8:47 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

But it's still listed in the Most Viewed column on the right side. Nice try Navy Times.

2/10/2012 9:14 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Is there any way to "out" the people pulling the strings behind the scenes to suppress information?

2/10/2012 10:15 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Probably best to simply point out what's happening to various, appropriate news/journalist sources. The Navy may...may...still be conducting an investigation into the "COB'd middie" story.

While a 'criminal' investigation for adultery or "conduct unbecoming" seems unlikely (though a court-martial or two not inappropriate), me-thinks it's fairly clear that a cover-up is in the works...thus the various information/news deletions.

But let the professionals handle it; nobody here needs to deal with any kind of 'obstructing justice' blather, however thin the veil of a cover-up may be.

2/10/2012 11:35 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Looks like the story is back up

2/10/2012 12:56 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Scary stuff!

I saved the webpage so I can post it when I want to.

I have known DD for a long time and it is no suprise he was doing her dirty in the COB's office (that's Missle Compartment 3rd Level for you SSN guys)!

2/10/2012 12:56 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Y'know, come to think of it, it's possible that the COB-middie activity was perfectly legit.

Neither one of them was in the other's chain-of-command...and that's the Navy's litmus test for inappropriate hankie pankie.

Also note that a relief "for cause" didn't happen. The COB's departure is either a cover-up, or merely "convenient."

2/10/2012 1:18 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I heard he as already been retired. He is no longer on the base.

The Navy never wanted this information to be released and that is where the investigation is heading now....they are looking for Deep Throat (no pun intended and that is a Watergate Scandal reference for you young kids).

2/10/2012 1:28 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Neither one of them was in the other's chain-of-command...and that's the Navy's litmus test for inappropriate hankie pankie."

That's not true, she was TDY for duty onboard the ship.

Then again, maybe her orders had "Variations Authorized" and in the "remarks" box it read: "Permission is granted for the COB to put his wanker in your pie hole".

2/10/2012 1:34 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Guess again: The middie did not report to the COB, and the COB certainly didn't report to the middie.

Same is true when you follow their individual chain's of command; i.e., neither was a 'superior' of the other.

The middie's being TDY to the ship does not put either of them in a senior reporting position to the other.

2/10/2012 1:37 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"The Navy never wanted this information to be released and that is where the investigation is heading now....they are looking for Deep Throat..."

It wouldn't surprise me if the investigators, as decribed above, became the "investigatees"...whistleblowers are protected by Federal statute, and if this is a cover-up (again...the COB wasn't prosecuted) the blow-back could become something to behold. Very publicly at that.

2/10/2012 1:43 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

DD retired quietly huh...

"I hear nothing, I see nothing, I know nothing!" - Sergeant Schultz

2/10/2012 1:53 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

That sort of reminds me of Bob Dole's comment once upon a time about a gathering of ex-presidents during the Reagan era that included Jimmy Carter, Gerald Ford and Richard Nixon.

He stated that it was a gathering of "Speak-no-Evil, Hear-no-Evil...and Evil."

2/10/2012 2:01 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The statement about the COB not being prosecuted (depending on your definition) is untrue.

2/10/2012 2:03 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Expecting a court-martial for the COB is probably a bit much...especially when compared to nine people being killed by USS Greeneville, with no court-martial afterwards.


2/10/2012 2:28 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"...heard he as already been retired. He is no longer on the base." He may no longer be on the base (leave?), but he is still active duty. He has years of contract time left, although an expedited fleet reserve request in this kind of situation would not be unexpected. He is even still attached to the boat (although that is probably just paper admin that hasn't caught up electronically yet). This investigation has gone on for months from what I was told. Hard to tell if that was purposeful dragging of feet or NCIS being exhaustively comprehensive.
Conveniently enough, nothing formal was done until after the Non-continuation board was held... If he fights things and can deal with the disgrace and resist the pressure to retire right away he could probably hold on until 130930- when next year's non-continuation board would give him the axe. The non-continuation board was designed for exactly this kind of thing so we aren't stuck with dead weight until 30yrs TIS.

2/10/2012 4:37 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

An embarrasment to the sub and CPO community. He did not get a nickname of "dirty Dave" for no reason. Who screened this guy for COB? Another advancement quota flushed down the toilet!

2/10/2012 4:59 PM

Anonymous submarines once... said...

Whatever happened to the old submarine saying "We might as well start with the truth cuz sooner or later we are gonna end up there?" Or am I missing something in the track of this thread? How does this play in the "Cold light of Day?"

2/10/2012 5:22 PM

Anonymous jay the Nuk said...

Ok, people seem to imply Dave was "Dirty Dave" way before this incident. What are the facts behind those statements???

2/10/2012 6:01 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said... They didn't have to be at the same command, and her TDY status or lack thereof makes no difference. See 5a & 6b.

2/10/2012 6:55 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Just to clarify, the nickname "dirty Dave" was given a long time ago, prior to getting to this boat. By the way, do you know what dirty really means: clean or pure, morally unclean or corrupt:likely to cause disgrace or scandal, highly regrettable. Do I need to say more!

2/10/2012 7:19 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Interesting, Neb. was only supposed to be underway with the girls for two weeks, ended up staying out almost two months from what I heard with the girls stuck on board the whole time.

Someone should tell these girls only wives get their dolphins from having sex on board, not crew members!

2/10/2012 8:39 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dirty Dave was "fired" due to another reason besides poking the middie. They (good ol' boy club) threw out a distractor so that the real news would be an after thought. It's common practice especially in high visibility political situations. Navy is doing alot of dancing, bobing and weaving trying to keep this out of the mainstream. Unless someone pushes, the article in Navy Times will be the last of it.

2/10/2012 9:01 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dirty Dave refers to prior actions during his career. He was pretty well know for some pretty stupid stuff and yes, he had been to mast earlier in his career but don't hold that against him. The smart E-9s at the 7,8 and 9 board didn't so he must have been a good sailor right? He was just horney!

2/10/2012 9:08 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I feel sorry for the middie who, after getting kicked out of the Naval Academy, wakes up one morning and wonders what she was doing. Throwing an opportunity away like that for some old fat guy with something that looks like a penis, only smaller.

I am sure her parents will be proud!

2/10/2012 9:35 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

It will really suck if she is pregnant!

2/10/2012 10:17 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

So....Boomer Fags...

Who is this Dirty Dave E9??

(notice the lacking of the proper Master Chief salutation)

I'd hide in shame if I was a Bangor Bunny CPO that tolerated this BS that earned him his name and failed to prevent this fiasco.


2/10/2012 11:47 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

So, how can you "Fire" a CPO or above without a DFC? The Navytimes has the link posted again.

Haven't seen this tactic before

2/11/2012 12:26 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

So, why did the 742G CO get relieved?

2/11/2012 1:31 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"So, how can you "Fire" a CPO or above without a DFC.". It is called 'soft-landing' someone. Local authority figures out a way to get the non-performer TEMDU'd off the boat And demands a relief. Mealy-mouth way of ducking doing things the right way through a formal DFC process. It isn't right but it happens frequently.

2/11/2012 8:00 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"So, why did the 742G CO get relieved?"

We are still working through Dity Dave here. These things take time. And we still have the USS Cowpens firing to deal with.

Not to mention there rumors brewing about a boat in Pearl.

So don't worry, 742G CO will get his time in the seat and TSSBP.

2/11/2012 10:03 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dave got pulled off the boat for a security clearance issue, not something punitive. Whole separate deal on the middie thing, he went to mast a month after he left the boat.

2/11/2012 10:18 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Was it because he had classified material at his house from his previous ANAV tour? Who turned him of his many ex-wives? Current wife?

When the man gets your laptop and is searching through it...not a good time to have picture of your middy girlfriend!

The Navy was hoping for an easy excuse to get rid of Dirty Dave on the classified material charge and keeping women on submarine issue quiet for obvious reasons. After all men and women wouldn't have sex on a submarine!

Not sure how that logic works since there have cases on men having sex with each other onboard. Why wouldn't normal men and women have sex?

Anyway, DD has burst the submarine social engineering bubble.

The only saving grace is that the Navy will name a ship after a lady who took a bullet in the brain from a physco killer to forever memoralize a crime. The current joke is that the USS Gabrielle Giffords will be able to take rounds in CIC and keep on working!

2/11/2012 10:40 AM

Blogger nooner said...

SUBRON 20 helped us coordinate training up for an IRPI replacement. We practiced @TTF a couple of times, then did the job without issues. Otherwise, another set of eyes on paperwork etc., but they were pretty decent and didn't bother us much when they were aboard.

2/11/2012 12:11 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

20 is a joke. The Commodore is a pompous ass.

2/11/2012 3:31 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

""So, why did the 742G CO get relieved?"

We are still working through Dity Dave here. These things take time. And we still have the USS Cowpens firing to deal with.

Not to mention there rumors brewing about a boat in Pearl.

So don't worry, 742G CO will get his time in the seat and TSSBP."

Don't be so sure the 742G ex-CO will make it to open press. The 1120 Flags are determined to save him the embarrassment even though there are rumors that in addition to a punitive letter at ADM Mast, he is going to have his nuclear AQDs removed. Since they held the mast after the O-6 board and are keeping it out of open press, they must be determined to allow him to make CAPT for the minority statistics in the community.

2/13/2012 2:38 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

WTF did the 742G ex-CO do to be sent to ADM Mast, be relieved of command, and have his AQD's removed? Nobody seems to want to discuss it.

2/13/2012 3:35 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

742(G) CO will not make O-6. Based on the NJP, Navy selection board review process will have him pulled off the list even if he was selected by the board. AQD removals are just the normal matter of course for a nuclear officer getting NJP. No conspiracy here, just a tough business and a tough professional situation onboard 742.

2/13/2012 8:33 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

But what is the particular mark of stupidity requiring his firing?

Is it the thing with the female supp o?

2/14/2012 5:23 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The Navy finally admitted 742G CO was fired. He'll still make O-6 since they held the info until the board finished.

Here is the Navy Slimes link.

2/17/2012 5:30 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The Navy finally admitted 742G CO was fired. He'll still make O-6 since they held the info until the board finished.

Here is the Navy Slimes link.

Seriously? You really think this guy is going to go full bird after this???

2/18/2012 9:16 AM

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