Keeping the blogosphere posted on the goings on of the world of submarines since late 2004... and mocking and belittling general foolishness wherever it may be found. Idaho's first and foremost submarine blog. (If you don't like something on this blog, please E-mail me; don't call me at home.)

Thursday, January 10, 2008

I Call On Bryan Fischer To Prove That He's An American Citizen

Here in Idaho, there's this guy with a "no comments allowed" website and a 1,300 person mailing list (at least some of them people who don't agree with him and just want a daily chuckle) who gets an inordinate amount of attention from the press as the state's self-styled spokesman for Family Values. He's come up with some kooky ideas recently (like the one where he wants us to only vote for unpledged Electors, and get rid of the 11th and 12th grades for most kids) but today he threw one out that just plain pisses me off. Seems he thinks illegal immigrants are a threat to Idaho Families (at least the type of family that he recognizes) and he's jumped on the "anchor baby" bandwagon:
Although bad Supreme Court precedent has resulted in the custom of granting citizenship to the children of illegals born on American soil, a careful and accurate reading of the Constitution reveals that this is just another instance of judicial activism gone awry.
The 14th Amendment, passed in the wake of the Civil War, was enacted to prevent any of the former slave-holding states from denying citizenship to the children of slaves who were born in the United States prior to the end of the Civil War.
It makes clear that citizenship is guaranteed only to “persons born … in the United States” if they are also “subject to the jurisdiction thereof.”
Slaves, and the children born to them prior to the end of the Civil War, were clearly subject to the jurisdiction of the laws of the United States, including the onerous laws that permitted slavery in the first place.
But obviously illegal aliens are not “subject to the jurisdiction” of the United States, which is why they choose to live “in the shadows” and can be deported immediately upon detection.
The unfortunate misreading and misapplication of the 14th Amendment by the Court, which invented the “anchor baby” category of citizenship, does not need to be corrected by another constitutional amendment. It can and should be corrected by a Court that respects the original intent of Congress and the states when they enshrined this provision in the Constitution in the first place.
I guess if Mr. Fischer believes illegal aliens aren't subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, then he would want to deport this guy without having him serve his prison time. My point here, though, is how do we prove that anyone is a citizen if not for the wording of the 14th Amendment -- especially if, as Mr. Fischer wants, it wouldn't require another Constitutional amendment. Should someone automatically be a citizen if one of their parents was a citizen? OK, how do we know their parents and grandparents and great-grandparents were citizens, if not for a birth certificate saying they were born in the United States (which wouldn't be useful under Bryan's Rules)? The only way is for someone to have naturalization papers, signed by a judge. (Or, I suppose, be a bonafide member of an Indian tribe where there's a chain of legislation granting all members of said tribe citizenship at some point.)

So would Mr. Fischer pass this test? Can he come up with naturalization papers for any of his ancestors, along with birth cerificates (original and notarized, please -- you know those things can be forged) for the whole chain from the naturalized ancestor to him? If not, he should immediately demonstrate that he stands behind his words and remove himself immediately to the land of his ancestors -- probably Prussia.

(Slightly off topic, but in case you get the idea that Idaho only has right-wing extremists, the left doesn't get a free pass -- the Idaho Democratic Party just invited Daily Kos guy Markus "Screw Them" Zuniga to speak at their big yearly dinner. Not quite the best way to show independent Idaho voters that the Idaho Democratic Party isn't just the party of the Angry Left.)


Anonymous chris said...


I think it may be wise for you to maybe pick up Markos' book, or perhaps read more posts by him. You'll probably find that his politics are more in line with yours than you think. DailyKos isn't the DemocraticUnderground by any stretch of the imagination. Are there some crazies that post there; sure, look how many people visit it, you're bound to get some wackjobs. But make sure you read the front page stuff, it's not as far to the left as you may think it is.

As for the "screw them"? Why not? I don't know about you in the Navy but in the Army I worked with a lot of contractors. They weren't there to uphold the Constitution or protect the freedoms of anyone, they were there to make a buck. Contractors day in and day out put real military men and women's lives at risk, all so they can make some money and line the pockets of their employers.

Why should we risk the life of a 19-year-old PVT in the infantry to help out some guy who is doing what amounts to war profiteering? I'm sorry if I also lack sympathy for these people. They are not soldiers and they have no place being in a war zone. They are not bound by the UCMJ, they are not bound by any law and most importantly they are not bound by honor.

I like the way you look at a lot of things Bubblehead and agree with you quite a bit; I also think we both agree that politics and the people it employees are quite absurd from all angles, but I do think you're wrong when it comes to Markos.

1/11/2008 7:00 AM

Anonymous Alan said...

I gotta agree with Chris. Markos is not lefty nut. Democraticunderground may be populated with idiots (I never go there so I don't know) but DailyKos isn't. It's a pretty thoughtful site. No conspiracy theories, no expletive laden screeds. In fact, I've seen Kos ask folks to contact various congresspersons, and he almost always urges that the contact be polite and respectful.

Knowing your politics a bit, I also agree with Chris that you and Markos are not so far apart. Sorry.

1/11/2008 9:02 AM

Anonymous Sisyphus said...

I echo your comments Alan and Chris. Please Bubbles familiarize yourself first with the site and the community there before you start casting stones.

1/12/2008 6:02 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

With regard to DailyKos, perception is reality, and undoubtedly the site is a place filled with hard left opinions and lots of vitriol for the other side. Whether the guy is providing forum for this platform or a part of it himself, I'm guessing he expects some accountibility for the content. And the content isn't going to bode well for bringing out the independents for Dems in ID. Plus, I didn't read any stone thwowing in that article, just analysis of the effects of inviting a personality like Kos in a state like ID.

Many European countries don't give citizenship to people born on their soil. I wonder how they prove their citizenship.

1/13/2008 1:40 PM

Blogger ThomG said...

To be honest most "Independents" in CD1 are straight ticket Republicans who enjoy the perception of being an Old Time Wild West Independent.

1/15/2008 11:55 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...


2310 Oak Leigh Dr

Tupelo, MS 38801-6163

Do not worry, Fischer wants you to contact him.

10/20/2010 9:31 AM


Post a Comment

<< Home