Keeping the blogosphere posted on the goings on of the world of submarines since late 2004... and mocking and belittling general foolishness wherever it may be found. Idaho's first and foremost submarine blog. (If you don't like something on this blog, please E-mail me; don't call me at home.)

Friday, August 24, 2012

While I've Been Off-Line...

Sorry for the non-existent posting over the last many days; I was visiting my folks back in the land of the dial-up Internet connection. Here are some submarine-related items that have been in the news since then:

1) The Navy announced a schedule for the rebuilding of USS Miami (SSN 755) following the shipyard fire.

2) DARPA has an "unmanned submarine hunter" program. It won't work until we get computers that think like humans since there are so many extraneous submarine-like noises in the ocean that it'll lock on to something other than a submarine, but it's still pretty cool from a geek perspective.

3) PCU North Dakota (SSN 784) released their official ship's crest. I've seen worse. Not so much with the ship's motto "Strength from the Soil", which sucks just about as much ass as any boat's motto I've ever heard. It's especially disturbing that they chose that when they had the much better option "Reapers of the Deep" alongside it on their crest. I'm guessing the PTB decided the latter was too "warlike", so they had to adopt the pussified version as the official motto; I'm glad they kept the better version visible on the coat of arms.

4) Here's an interesting report from a Guardian reporter about his ride on HMS Triumph (S 93).

5) And here's the long-form trailer for the upcoming new ABC series "Last Resort", apparently about a boomer that declares themselves an independent nation after getting genocidal orders from the evil U.S. military establishment. I'm not guessing it'll have a lot in the way of an accurate depiction of submarine life, but I'm sure we'll learn a lot about how evil either the CIA or conservatives in the U.S. military/government are (or maybe even the evil military/industrial complex, along with oil companies).


Blogger Don the Baptist said...

Last Resort? Oy!

8/24/2012 6:09 PM

Blogger Don the Baptist said...

Last resort? Oy!

8/24/2012 6:09 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Can't wait to see that show.

Still for the life of me cant figure out why we are repairing Miami and not just making it an MTS

8/24/2012 7:39 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

What, no news about Master Chief Vatter? I'm disappointed.

8/24/2012 8:14 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said... Gives "Document does not exist" which is a pretty good sign Vatter got the axe. Anyone know why?

8/24/2012 8:31 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I heard it had something to do with mistreatment of CPO selects, but who knows with that guy. It seems like a stretch, but I wouldn't put anything past that asshat.

8/24/2012 9:47 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Your "I've seen worse" link goes to.....the USS North Dakota logo. Now I'm confused. Have you really seen worse? Or are you toying with my semi-inebriated mind???

8/24/2012 9:50 PM

Blogger Chap said...

Oh geez. That logo sounds like it's going to be embarrassing in a grounding...

8/24/2012 10:41 PM

Blogger John Byron said...

2). Sonarmen rule!

8/25/2012 3:30 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Strength from the soil? YGBSM?
So, is that like "ice hardened steel"? Bounce off the ground first?
Sounds like they wanna be a mud dart.
CNO says the Miami will come out of the yards without any operational limitations? How many PMS 392 guys gonna be on board for the deep dive to design test depth? From history, most hull cracks have sealed at depth, so I'll guess that will be news a couple of years after, 'bout like the Bremelo's first SRA.


8/25/2012 3:56 AM

Blogger Curt said...

Google's snapshot of the page as it appeared on Aug 5, 2012 06:49:15 GMT - COMMAND MASTER CHIEF THOMAS VATTER.

8/25/2012 5:56 AM

Blogger SJV said...

Now that we've got lady officers we can get back on TV!

8/25/2012 6:57 AM

Anonymous 4-Stop said...

Top 5 crap Submarine crests
SSN-21 USS Seawolf, a shout out to the submarine city of Akron Ohio?
SSN -720 USS Pittsburgh, any clue what the hell they were trying to say with that?
SSN -752 USS Pasadena, a fighting turtle really?
SSN -688 USS Los Angeles, way too cartoony a first grader could draw better.
SSN -722 USS Key West, come on a long black tube in pink cave.

8/25/2012 7:23 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

There is another CMC in Bangor that has been tube loaded. Right now they are doing fire control checks and then fire tube 1!

Also, heard something about a Pearl COB...but mostly rumor at this point.

8/25/2012 9:59 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Will script writers for "Last Resort" make certain Daisy Betts, the comely Australian actress who plays LT Grace Shepard demonstrates that her character: 1) commands respect from the submarine's crew; and that she possesses all of the 2) intellect; 3) physical stamina; 4) patriotism and; 5) willingness for heroic sacrifice as her male counterparts?

"Last Resort" is the second submarine mini-series since the Pentagon's Feb 2010 decision to allow women volunteers on U.S.
subs. The first premiered August 2010 attracting neither the hoped for female viewers nor complimentary male reviews: Minnie Driver is Submarine Driver.

Repercussions for the sub force are serious according to M.E.'s latest.

8/25/2012 1:56 PM

Blogger KellyJ said...

So the Boomer crew has a tizzy-fit and decides to be their own Nation (and just how many of the sailors are going to go along with that little thing called treason?).
And in 3 months when their down to the last can of unidentifiable vegetable matter (how many Fast Boat guys have experienced that last can of something due to extended ops) they plan on getting more food from.....
Perhaps they can surface next to a cruise liner and threaten to put a fish in her if they don't hand over some grub (and chicks!).

8/25/2012 8:33 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

My wife just can't understand why I think Last Resort is going to be a dumb assed show.

Just heard a tease tonight and told her it was crap - hurt her feelings, sighhhh.

Old chief from the dark ages

8/25/2012 11:50 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Who and why?

8/25/2012 11:58 PM

Anonymous Hayes said...

USS Pittsurgh - The triangle shape is implied by the three rivers meeting in a point (Allegheny, Monongehela, Ohio). With three rivers - lots of bridges. Pittsburgh once had a major bridge building industry; even now the annual international bridge conference is held in Pittsburgh.

8/26/2012 7:27 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Former CMC Vatter was quietly relieved of his duties after an IG investigation where they received a report and then questioned all his fellow CMC buddies. Rumors are rampant because people are struggling to keep this quiet. I am sure the IG report will be an interesting read.

8/26/2012 7:27 AM

Anonymous NHSparky said...

Well, let's see--the last time ABC tried a Navy-based series (Supercarrier) it was a huge steaming pile. And looking at this trailer, no reason to suspect this will be any different.

Vegas oddsmakers have the over/under on this show at three episodes. Any show that has them doing La Bamba instead of a shellback ceremony you KNOW is gonna stink on ice.

8/26/2012 9:41 AM

Anonymous NHSparky said...

ETA: And yeah, the ND's emblem/motto is teh suckage, but hey--at least they're not Pier 23. I still think California's emblem and motto are the VA-class boat to beat. JMHO.

8/26/2012 9:46 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

California's is good, I like the Minnesota crest as well.

So the CMC network in Groton is trying to keep something covered up? Color me surprised...

8/26/2012 10:26 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

estackgr 6esrypor 610Judging by the article of life on the Brit sub (Americanism) our boats are luxury liners in comparison. So the Brits don't have any decent climate control?

8/26/2012 12:32 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon at 1026

The base CO needs to come out and just say what happened. There are some ugly rumors running around about inappropriate behavior on Vatters part, knowledge of said behavior by the CMC "fraternity" and failure to report said behavior.

8/26/2012 2:20 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm sick of the shit that goes on here.I have been trying to negotiate for orders out of here very since the Annapolis debacle. Check the math, there will never be a COB generated out of Groton because the ring kissing goes out to the retirees. The reason why you will never here about Vatter is because the Groton mafia will not allow it! IG should camp out up here and put an end to this crap. I would rather go to the PACNORWEST and deal with that mess than stay here.

8/26/2012 4:28 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Inappropirate behavior! HAHAHAHAHA! Way understated!

8/26/2012 4:30 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Can the term "skinny dipping" be applied here?

8/26/2012 5:12 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

You are a bunch of ass clowns. U r weak u need to leave there a lot of quality chiefs in Groton. Only the weak losers post shit on here the rest are leading our sailors. How about looking at the good stuff our guys r doing. Did u forget that. Yes people fuck up live with it and move on

8/26/2012 5:36 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Live with it and move on? Really. No thanks. There are ALOT of good Chiefs and Officers everywhere, Groton included. All the good ones get a black eye when COBs and CO's do stupid stuff. Greg Cordray, now Vatter (details not revealed yet), Dirty Dave in Bangor. Mr. Ward of the weeklong CO tour on the 720. CDR Klein and Williams of the 771, Patel's DUI, etc. Expecting folks to just 'live with it' is a loser attitude. Our Sailors deserve better.

8/26/2012 5:56 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Good news for the Fighting Double Nickel. I love the VIRGINIA logo, how many other submarine logos have a bare breast!

8/26/2012 6:23 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon at 8/26/2012 5:36 PM

Keep up the ass-kissing, once the Master Chief clowns are gone here you will have to find others to sidle up next to. Make sure you charge book has a pen with it. Carry it with you when you pull up a stool at the end of the bar, you'll go far here. Just make sure you tell'em all you stuck up for them!

8/26/2012 6:35 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Move on with it! What i meant was i am tired of all the belly aching from guys stating that they want to be a cob but not in groton. Things are happening everywhere. Not just in groton. No details on base CMC, just rumors and as we know rumors only part of the truth. I think he has done 3 COB tours and a few CMC tours. Maybe the guy needs a break to let things unfold. I hear he is leaving due to personnel reasons, could this be something that he really needs to do? How about we let him fix what ever is wrong and give it sometime. I have only seen good things out of him, was a driving force on the CPOI when i made Chief. I think we need to slow down and see how this plays out.

8/26/2012 6:48 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Get a life! It's not gonna change here and you know it. The powers to be have been reaching out from the Fleet Reserve and no one gets a chance unless your in the click. We let CMC's who have committed credit card fraud, open to the public infidelity. Now last but not least a CMC who thinks the rules he enforces do not pertain to him, they all get away with soft landing after soft landing. Are you telling me I am supposed to strive to be like these guys because they were cool during CPOI? Whatever dude! When you return to planet Earth look me up, I will be here in Groton watching the insanity!

8/26/2012 7:14 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

As a taxpayer, what an absolute waste of money to throw into a 22 year old boat!

Classic bloated military project with big Navy spending other people's money.

And right off the bat they already added 50 million to the repair cost.

That's right, half a BILLION dollars into a 688? Seriously?

Rather than canning guys for getting a piece of ass on the side, heads should roll for even considering spending that kind of coin on a dinosaur.

8/26/2012 7:20 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

$500 million on a 688? Good lord that's what they cost brand new! (not accounting for inflation obviously).

Vatter in the news as being relieved....

With all of the firings can anybody really defend the sub force any more? At least 20% of senior leaders are corrupt, incompetent or scum bags. It's fucking pathetic.

I knew it when I put my letter in, and every day I am just thankful that I left when I did.

8/26/2012 10:36 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why does Groton hide the truth? There are good reasons to lay the cards on the table. We owe to the tax payers when an ass hat like this gets relieved to know the truth. No wonder the MCPON selects the candidates, he has to answer the questions when we have a CMC acting inappropriate.

Who's really in charge in Groton?

8/27/2012 2:32 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Late breaking news: Someone just crossed the street in front of the navy yard outside of the crosswalk. Anyone know who this was? How many other rules is that person breaking? How deep does this go? Should we look into it? Rumor has it that person has done this before.

8/27/2012 2:55 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hmmm. Although, Strength From the Soil implies good farming instead of tundra, it is the totally non-PC nature of the native americans that gets me giggling.

Good to see that in this age of drubbing colleges for being the "Fighting Illini" we are going to have an official US Gov emblem that shows, once and for all, that six guns beat hand axes (or tomahawks or whatever). And from the land of the Lakota. Well done Navy!

8/27/2012 2:55 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

anony 10:36
we were glad when you left! we are always happy when ass clowns like you move on. Too bad you still are employed on the same base you hate so much.

8/27/2012 2:59 AM

Blogger miami said...

nice post!
Miami Dodge

8/27/2012 3:26 AM

Anonymous PUC NUC MUC said...

To the CMCDM Vatter Haters:

When you E7s and E8s have "Been there and done that" like he has, and walked a mile or two in his moccasins, then feel free to comment.

He was not Detached for Cause (DFC), so give it a break!

Quit your whining and man up to do at least 3 COB tours and several more CMC / SEA tours like he has.

8/27/2012 4:34 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am not hating on him, but Groton doesn't have the best track record lately. Why would a 3-time COB suddenly retire a year before the end of his tour? Why is a 9580 job being filled with an interim SCPO? Sounds like a soft landing for Vatter to me. If that isn't the case, please explain it.

8/27/2012 6:16 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...


Typically, Sailors that "do at least 3 COB tours and several more CMC / SEA tours..." move upward instead of laterally.

8/27/2012 6:55 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why does someone need to explain him to you. Personnel reasons is just that, they are personnel. Is it going to help you sleep at night know that he decided to retire earlier than he wanted, he is, will it help you be a better person to know he has problems at home, he does, will any new info help stop the bullshit in the world, it won't!!! Any new info on the J-walker in DC?

8/27/2012 7:36 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Chiefs leading from the front, naked with a beer in hand mind you, but still providing that front line leadership of “Do as I say not as I do” mentality. The Groton Assclown mafia at its best, Man I love this.

And yes I am posting “ANNON” because these assclowns can still affect my future.

8/27/2012 8:36 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Suddenly retiring long before EAOS, after an in-depth Inspector General investigation does not equate to personal reasons (not personnel).

8/27/2012 8:56 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The Sub Force is covering this one up to prevent more bad press. Vatter is the same $h!t bag he has been since he was DEVRON 12 CMC. He road my boat and was the typical squadron rider, as useful as a football bat. He is certainly benefitting from a soft landing because the Navy doesn't want to report another senior enlisted DFC and the Sub force doesn't want more bad press.

8/27/2012 10:29 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

He rode us when he was Deveron 12, did nothing but help us out. He was one of the best we had. Knew where to look and how to help. You must have been really fucked up to think he was not there to help. He probally pointed out how screwed up you were and made the correct changes. I was on staff with him and he did nothing but help the boats out. He can get a little crazy at times but we all do. Can't wait to see what is next. Hey why don't you all look into your closet and pull out all the fucked up shit you have done. He has done more than most and will be just fine. Soft landing i think not, he is leaving what he loves to do! We are not better off with out him. Wake up!!!!

8/27/2012 1:29 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"He can get a little crazy at times but we all do."
So what kind of 'crazy' is making him leave early? If this is a case of him not being PC enough, just put it on the table already instead of dancing around it.

"Can't wait to see what is next. Hey why don't you all look into your closet and pull out all the fucked up shit you have done.". Yeah, I have done some things I am not proud of, back when I was a PO3/PO2. Then I grew up!

I'm not looking to vilify him, I just want to know what he did, and why is it once again 'circle the wagons' time in Groton. It WILL get out - just a matter of time. If you don't report it, and you know about it, you are in essence condoning the behavior. Subase CNIC PAO will have to make a statement sooner or later.

8/27/2012 1:53 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"I'm not looking to vilify him, I just want to know what he did."

Well, if you've not been told what he did, THEN ITS NONE OF YOUR FUCKING BUSINESS!!!

8/27/2012 3:05 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

We will find out. Better go to Fleet & Family and schedule some classes if an Internet blog makes you that angry.

8/27/2012 3:38 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I would argue that if I, as a CMC/COB, am being judged in a different light because of his actions, it is my business, at least a little bit. It doesn't need to be in Navy Times necessarily, but a classic Groton rug-sweeping exercise is not the right answer either.

8/27/2012 3:43 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

When he punches his wife in public in front of his Master Chief buddies and NONE of them report it but someone else does it is all of our business.

When he threatens Sailors below him not to report his drunken actions on base with his Master Chief buddies it is our business. He is a fucking embarrassment and a disgrace to the uniform.

It will all come out. Goodbye you giant pile of shit.

8/27/2012 4:33 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thanks Tony Allen you have said it all. I don't know why you keep typing under Anonymous it is just silly. It is guys like you who get shit canned that won't let it go. great job on fucking over others because you were booted out for issues. Touched any kids lately? i hope there is a sign outside your house.
you punk ass bastard!!!!

8/27/2012 4:47 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

oh yeah how could we forget Tony Allen, that guy on Texas who drank too much, touched kids, lied, tried to cover up things and then shit canned. I hear he is doing well now fucking over anyone he can. What a class act, watch you back when that shithead is around. I hear he works out of groton from time to time, watch out mess he is in the shadow's. Waiting for his next victium to fuck over. And he wanted to be a COB. Now his claim to fame is posting on this bullshit website. Good for you!!

8/27/2012 4:52 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Ok. Don't know who the fuck Tony Allen is, but it would seem he is out of the Navy.

What is the deal with the allegation of the base CMC acting a fool and then trying to cover it up?

8/27/2012 4:57 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I hear the former Base CMC is retiring soonest, so why do you need info? He is moving on. As it should be

8/27/2012 5:03 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think we should know because we punish Sailors for this all the time preventing them from retiring on the taxpayers dime.

This guy who allegedly violated several articles of the UCMJ will be allowed to ride out into the sunset and the people who know preach the CPO creed stood by and did nothing.

8/27/2012 5:11 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Make sure you find the creed, we all know you don't know it, you will have to find it to read the words then they still won't mean anything to you. Yes he will ride into the sunset, but what ucmj art. did he break what do you know? oh yeah just speculations. do you have hard data, if so share it. You are doing a great job keeping this going though. You do man!!!

8/27/2012 5:17 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

So, how about that show Last Resort?

And way up the board someone called the Pasadenas crest dumb. It's a fighting turtle. Nothing more bad ass than that...need sarcasm font.

Anyone want to guess what the PCU John Warners crest/logo will be? They are still going to name the 785 boat after him, right?

8/27/2012 5:32 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

2) DARPA has an "unmanned submarine hunter" program.

It won't be reliable if a competent enemy captures, studies and designs countermeasures or back door hacks for its programmed logic. The press release is an obvious red herring.


8/27/2012 8:07 PM

Anonymous Former Squadron Rider said...

Two thoughts on "Strength from the soil":

#1. There better not be ANY dirt on that boat or else!

#2. How, exactly, are they going to save the CO if they verify the ship's "strength" by running it into "the soil"? Pretty damned ironic to fire the Captain for verifying his ship's motto.

8/27/2012 9:57 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

The "douche bags" that are defending a man that has obviously been relieved early for some reason/cause are making it quite easy for the rest of us to see what's happening. Over and over again we hear and read how we should mind our business when it comes to CMC/COBs in Groton, Really??? It is everyone's business! It is our business to ensure the junior sailors we are charged with leading are led by those that hold themselves to a higher standard all of the time! When the real story comes out, all of you defenders of a man who disgarced himself will truly be "ass clowns"!

Serving EDMC!

8/27/2012 11:30 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

It was not too long ago that everyone in Groton was raining down on every Chief here in Bangor. Supposedly we were jacked up and Groton was the leadership capital of the world. Look how quickly we fall! This is just a shining example of the dirt bag CMCs in Groton who think they are above the rules and regulations they swore to uphold. Each occurrence tops the next, it's lunacy. I am clearly disgusted at the Chiefs who stand by and let this happen, then try and defend the man that has disgraced the anchors. Each statement you make that condones that type of behavior, makes you look more like a dunmbass day after day. All I ask is that you don't join the COB/CMC ranks. If you need good leadership, ask we will send it out to you!


8/28/2012 3:36 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Moving on to MIAMI - Should be interesting what lessons are relearned out of this fiasco.

1. Don't let shitbird SY folks hang out inside the ship (requires that you are actually on the ship to enforce this).
2. Don't let the SY stage rags, etc inside the ship (requires that you frequently check and enforce)
3. Perform more than the minimum firefighting drills with the SY fire hoses and repeat frequently to ensure that everyone is proficient. (Requires that you get off the barge and back on your boat)

8/28/2012 4:46 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Oh, FYI on Tony Allen...He was selected for non-continuation and forced to retire- that was awhile ago. The system worked in spite of those trying to cover up his multiple ARI's.

If Vatter smacked his wife in public (or private) he deserves to go home early, and he needs to get some help. That's domestic abuse and battery, and he should be charged with Artucle 128 if that's what happened.

To those name calling the few of us upholding our Core Values, do you really want to keep circling the wagons? Maybe Vatter was an awesome COB (3x), but if he has a problem with his temper it is time to go, and he shouldn't be leading Sailors any longer, regardless of how great he was at it. He has lost his way. Instead of trying to hide this from our Sailors, Groton should be showing Sailors that domestic abuse by ANYONE, regardless of rank and career history, isn't tolerated. That would uphold good order & discipline better than letting him slip out the door quietly. To those that saw the battery and did nothing, shame on you!

If that isn't what happened, then spill it and I will happily stand corrected.

8/28/2012 5:35 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Shades of gray. What if he didn't smack her, but they both were just yelling at each other? What if he didn't smack her, but grabbed her wrist to prevent her from smacking him? Have you ever had a fight with your wife? In public? It's already embarrassing enough - is ending the career really called for?

8/28/2012 6:46 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...


8/28/2012 6:51 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

If it was serious enough that the CO put a SCPO in to relieve him, then I would say yes. If it wasn't assault or battery but just an argument, he would probably still have his job. Have I ever fought with my wife? Argued, Sure. In public? No. We have been married a long tine, and when one or both of us get angry, we either leave together to settle it (with words, not fists) in private, or one leaves & the other gets a ride.

If he grabbed her, he was wrong. If there were people there witnessing the argument that didn't intervene, shame on them & maybe they could have prevented things from getting out of hand & he'd still have his job.

Helping him out before things went South is being a shipmate. Covering things up afterwards is being a sh*tmate.

8/28/2012 7:02 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Think about what your saying. Because of people like you, who try and dissect everything into "it's not that big of a deal", "give the guy a break", "he's a hero". Wake up!
I have my command sit through hours upon hours of mind numbing domestic violence training. Hours of SAPR-L training. Because of nimrods like you!
How about we try this, if you are a member of the TRIAD or leadership team or even a CPO, don't frequent bars at all hours of the night, dont get snot slinging drunk with your wife in public, don't climb a fence and go skinny dipping. Is that too hard? For the ass kissing clowns who condone that behavior but then turn around and lambaste the junior sailors for coming in to work with a hangover, look in the mirror. It will not be long before you will be in the headlines too! Your time is coming, because you have issues upstairs! Let's weed out the shit bags and get back to the strength of the Navy. The few that care are paying for the few who don't get it or think the rules do not pertain to them! If you have a problem with this entry, your part of the problem. Do us a favor and GTFO.

8/28/2012 7:32 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

It just seems to me that a lot of speculation and guilty until proven innocent is being directed at Vader. Maybe everyone should just shut up until the facts are known, or as has been said if you know the facts lets have them otherwise some of what is going on here borders on libel.

ret. MMCM

8/28/2012 9:15 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

What cover up??? Who is hiding anything?? the people that need to know, Know!! the rest who don't have the need to know just fuck off and live it alone. Nothing will change from what you write on here. His chain of command took action, yes his skipper held him accountable. Everyone can play arm chair quarter back, but the play will stay the same. Now if you have paid attention to the post's right or wrong everything was with his wife! No prego girl friend, no hookers, no drugs, just a drunk night that looks to have got out of control. Your right triad needs to be smart on liberty. Bars, clubs, social events are what we talk to our sailors about. He missed his time to practice what i am sure he was preaching. His behavior of a senior enlisted is still unsat, sounds like he needs to get help with a possible marriage(don't live at his home so don't really know) and drinking problem. so let's shit can another sailor without treatment. Sound about right he who sits in command and sits through hours upon hours of mind numbing domestic violence training. Someone missed the signs here. How many shipmates told him he had a problem. Classic!!! no one points out anything until it is posted on the ssbp

8/28/2012 9:41 AM

Blogger Buck said...

Re: reporter on submarine, an Australian reporter got to ride a working Collins class boat. The video is accompanied with some OZ defence sector politics.

8/28/2012 9:59 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Most of the commentary defending alleged abuses are well outside of the Naval Academy's exemplary norms and harken back to neanderthal attitudes towards women.

Maintaining such regressive attitudes is clearly forbidden by our SECNAV, and he has the weight of Congress behind him.

A primary reason to maintain the Academy in an era naval aggression
limited largely to cruise missile launches is to instill a political correctness in the officer corps as skilled role models for every leader from E-7 to O-6. Get used to it and shape up.

8/28/2012 10:05 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon at 9:41, where is the accountability for the Senior leaders who were with him that night? If one of my boys went out and was stupid, everyone with him would also be DRB'd as well. Depending on the circumstances, they might also face the music even though they just watched -simply because they didn't intervene or call for help. if we are going to preach to junior Sailors how to behave, we should be above reproach, including seniors watching out for other seniors during liberty. There are still ALOT of unknowns I'd like to know. ALOT of the earlier comments from Groton area folk have had the 'brush it under the rug' mentality. Did CNIC fly an OPREP/SITREP? If not, why not? If a junior Sailor gets iin trouble in such a public way, every COB gets briefed and you can bet that story is passed down to all hands before libs on Friday. The bar gets raised when you don the CMC/CO pin, and just because you have one doesn't mean their missteps should be covered up. The press statement said nothing about a DFC when naming DePaul interim CMC...Why not? If Vatterhit his wife and went skinny dipping, that certainly seems sufficient grounds for a DFC! No DFC gives the appearance of a cover up, and perception is reality in cases like this.

8/28/2012 10:59 AM

Blogger Curt said...

Rumor?? Let's Start One...

'I hear the FunFish is Broke Dick, and they can't get underway.

I hear we've been extended, again...'

8/28/2012 2:04 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon at 8/28/2012 9:41 AM
Don't respresent Groton anymore, you are a grammatical embarrassment.

8/28/2012 3:07 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon at 3:07

Leave that A-ganger alone he doesnt no what he sade.

8/28/2012 3:10 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why are so many people so quick in Groton to cover this up. I agree with an earlier post, if it requires action to DFC or soft land why is everyone getting worked up. Unless there is something to hide. I made a good decision getting out of Groton this year!

8/28/2012 3:16 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

News Flash: BRAC has taken Groton off the potential list permanently because of the chance of great blogs like this popping up in the future.

TSPIGSBP(The stupid people in Groton Shall be punished)

8/28/2012 4:08 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wow, dude tapped out. Didn't even use the asthma excuse. Hopefully the base CO made him ring the bell. Somewhere, AC/DC's "Have a Drink on Me" is playing. Holler!

8/28/2012 5:06 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Well earned retirement for CMDCM Vatter.

You fucks try 3 COB tours and additional SEA / CMC tours ashore. Last time I checked, we're all human, and a little forceful backup from the CPO "Mess" could have avoided all of this BS.

Now, let's get back to Joel's original post....$450 Million + to repair miami (notice the little letters, since obviously the crew doesn't care about it). Keep all of them onboard until it goes back to sea. Maybe they'll get it right their second time.

8/28/2012 5:18 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

So silent finally, that I just heard a pin drop!

Next post please Joel!

8/28/2012 5:52 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...


Unless there are any good discussions about the original topics that Joel posted.... miami fuckups, douche bag ship logos, ....

The Navy Enquirer has restarted the NWU "Blueberry" uniform discussion. Seems a push to try again is mounting. Interesting!

8/28/2012 5:55 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Wow, where to start with the last few days of comments? Here goes anyway:

Serving COB PACNORWEST: Don't worry, Bangor is still jacked up. After Dirty Dave and a few other lesser known incidents, Bangor has no room for bragging.

Grammar Nazi: "Anon at 8/28/2012 9:41 AM
Don't respresent Groton anymore, you are a grammatical embarrassment."

It is a cardinal sin to misspell a word during a grammar or spelling attack.

Boat Nazi: "Keep all of them onboard until it goes back to sea. Maybe they'll get it right their second time."

Way to think outside of the box and say something dumb. Let's hope you are not in any leadership position...ever!

8/28/2012 6:09 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I don't want to hear anymore Vatter bashing! Tommy was the reason most of us here became COBs. STFU and go back to your reclyners and your remotes, but leave the man alone!When you are brave enough and feel bad enough to carry the skin of his nutsack then you can talk crap, but otherwise you don't qualify to talk in this conversation. The Groton conversation is over also, there must be a lot of jealosy over our leadership and how we do business. We have got more submarines underway with this leadership than anyone of you will ever know. Get over it, it starts up here and ends up here. Submarine Capital of the World, never forget it! STFU

8/28/2012 6:19 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Newsflash: Groton COB's refuse to use spell check!

In other news: Several men were discovered carrying the skin of a man's nutsack.

The victim's wife became upset at seeing her husband's nutsack skin being so ever gently massaged and promptly punched him in the face.

The suspects, all in the Navy at the Groton Submarine Base, are well known to the victim and reportedly carried the nutsack skin before.

Details and film at 11.

8/28/2012 6:36 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...



8/28/2012 6:40 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Way to think outside of the box and say something dumb. Let's hope you are not in any leadership position...ever!"

Let's just call it OWNERSHIP. Is that "dumb?"

Name any other boats and shipyards too that allowed this to happen in the last 20 years!

Last I heard was the SY trying to sink SANDLANCE next to the pier with hull blank issues, well over 20 years ago.

8/28/2012 6:41 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"In other news: Several men were discovered carrying the skin of a man's nutsack."

Hey boomer fags in Bangor and KBay - they must have had it on their shoulders, not in their mouths like boomer fags do!

Sometimes when we SSN sailors "Hang Low and Swing To and Fro", a boomer wife usually helps us with the task!

8/28/2012 6:45 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

anon 6:40pm "Let's just call it OWNERSHIP. Is that "dumb?"

Name any other boats and shipyards too that allowed this to happen in the last 20 years!"

I hope your ignorance is not indicative of the fleet.

Could you please link us to a story where a submarine watchstander stopped someone who had complete authorization to be aboard from "loitering?"

How about a story where a watchstander stopped an authorized person to be on board from comitting arson in the middle of the act?

I would even settle for a story of a submarine successfully putting out a fire started due to arson when there was no EAB air available on board the ship except in 4 spots, none of which actually near the fire.

PS: And I bet you'll tell me that Miami is the only ship in the fleet to have her BDW perform a topside check.

All of our security procedures revolve around the assumption that someone who is going to do harm to the ship will not have proper ID. All of our firefighting doctrine revolves around the fact that the fire will be accidental. "High risk" evolutions get a fire watch. A painter with a bucket of supplies and a security clearance doesn't.

Give Miami a break...they weren't doing anything differently than you'd find on any other boat in the fleet. And to anonymously accuse Sailors, who risked their lives entering tube of metal on fire to save the rest of the ship, of lacking ownership is simple cowardice.

8/28/2012 7:06 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

News Flash: Groton CMC commits Government CC fraud while skinny dipping intoxicated in a foreign country without a liberty buddy. He is heard singing the "Submarine Song" as he flys home. When he soft lands home, to a ass kissing support cast of 100 PCOBs his wife got the backhand after she is caught on the left side of the bar ring kissing. His CO was unavailable for comment, rumor had it he was killed in IRAQ on a SOF mission! SUBMARINE CAPITAL.Yeaah!

8/28/2012 7:16 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Maybe we all should take a deep breath and remember that this is a public forum and maybe we should remember who we are. For all of you who think you have the right to know and that the Groton area is covering this up, you need to check yourself. If you went to any meetings involving the CPO mess, you would have heard what was going on. Yes, it was brought up at a CPOA meeting so that the Chief's that get involved in the Chief's mess would know what was going on. So if you are an E7, E8 or E9 and not a Chief, Senior Chief or Master Chief and don't support the area CPO mess then maybe you don’t have the right to know what the hell is going on in Groton. Maybe if you got off your ass and got involved with the Chief's Mess you would really know what goes on in the meetings, at the Club, and at the CPO functions. So here is a challenge to you all. Get involved and be in the know and help fix any problems we might have or sit back on your ass and run your mouth on this blog about shit you know nothing about. It's up to you to make a difference.

8/28/2012 7:17 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

News Flash: Groton CMC commits Government CC fraud while skinny dipping intoxicated in a foreign country without a liberty buddy. He is heard singing the "Submarine Song" as he flys home. When he soft lands home, to a ass kissing support cast of 100 PCOBs his wife got the backhand after she is caught on the left side of the bar ring kissing. His CO was unavailable for comment, rumor had it he was killed in IRAQ on a SOF mission! SUBMARINE CAPITAL.Yeaah!

8/28/2012 7:17 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

New post!

8/28/2012 7:25 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon @ 8/28/2012 7:17 PM

I will send a box of tissue out to you.

-Bangor CPO

8/28/2012 7:27 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon at 5:18 - Joe Paterno had an awesome reputation also, and that didn't save it from being ruined as a result of the Sandusky disaster that has resulted in the thrashing of a once proud and distinguished football program, and more important, the trauma to all those kids.

If Vatter truly hit his wife, he can take those COB tours (much like PSU's titles) and all the accolades and flush 'em, because he will still be a wife beater in the eyes of many (just like Sandusky is a child molester). Once the Navy Crimes gets a hold of the story (which they will), the Submarine Force will take yet another black eye... and our hallowed history as well as the justified respect of being a COB doing the hard job will be diminished as a result.

Hold his nut sack? I would rather rip it off and step on it. I'm sure he did ALOT of great things in his 26+ years, but you know what I was taught on my first boat? One 'aww shit!' erases a thousand 'atta-boy's. TSSBP!

8/28/2012 7:43 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

ND's logo should be an Annulus for fracking gas wells

8/28/2012 10:14 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I would rather watch the next Bachelor than this submarine TV show. I can't even get myself to watch the trailer, because it would result in committing the next two hours writing a worthless letter to the producers explaining how submarines REALLY work. (like when you watch Crimson Tide, Under Seige, etc).

Only realistic modern-ish submarine movie was Down Periscope. Who can argue??? (we even called our XO "Marty")

8/28/2012 11:01 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Down Periscope was awesome! And who wouldn't want Lauren Holly on the ship? "LT, you're almost out of uniform." Oh, sorry, academy grads aren't supposed to make statements like that.


8/29/2012 3:59 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

How many of Vatter's "supporters" know him in a context that doesn't include drinking as part of every social activity? And you guys call yourselves friends???

All those 1-2 year tours don't impress me much. Reading between the lines he flat-lined early for the same reason he's so popular with the Groton Senior Enlisted Mafia. The guy could probably use some help.

8/29/2012 4:28 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

" there was no EAB air available on board the ship except in 4 spots, none of which actually near the fire. "

Really? Only 4 temporary EAB manifolds in the forward compartment? WHO let that happen, both from the ship and shipyard.

Let me guess, no one actually ran a fire drill using the temp EAB manifolds and topside fire hoses to actually understand that the setup would never work.

Still goes back to OWNERSHIP.

Sounds to me that the lack of EAB manifolds and staging of rags in staterooms, along with the absence of anyone in the forward compartment led to supporting theis arsonist fuck.

All, except the arsonist fuck, are preventable with ownership.

Where were the SDO, EDO, EDPO, DCPO? They can't all be on the barge at the same time?

8/29/2012 4:48 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Read the report. Miami crew unless remarkably lucky could not have prevented this from happening. The Arsonist picked the right time, location, and method for starting the blaze.

Rebuilding her for half a billion is a mistake, but ohwell. Should turn her into an MTS.

784's motto seems destined to have them hit the soil and be a laughing stock afterwards.

The Aussie story was well done and I enjoyed it.

The DARPA thing was a joke but I'm sure the Projects boys have better stuff already that we can't talk about.

The TV show will be horrible.

8/29/2012 6:18 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm still waiting for a real-life story of another boat putting out a fire started from arson, not speculation and ridiculous finger pointing at brave Sailors who risked their lives.

8/29/2012 3:04 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

>> (we even called our XO "Marty")
I wish that Down Periscope had come out when Ken Milhoan was XO of Honolulu. He would have had an aneurysm if someone had called him Marty!

8/29/2012 7:56 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm still waiting for a real-life story of another boat putting out a fire started from arson, not speculation and ridiculous finger pointing at brave Sailors who risked their lives.

Will you settle for a ship? Enterprise had a serial arsonist onboard near the beginning of the last refueling overhaul.

They eventually caught him by correlating the fires with badge swipes to enter some of the work areas. If I remember correctly, it turned out to be a sailor.

8/29/2012 10:04 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

It doesn't matter how the fire starts, only how proficient your crew is at putting it out, given the following:

1. The state of your crew's training.
2. Watchstanding princples and practices (feet on the deckplates to catch it early)
3. Condition of the ship with respect to other flamable materials (which the crew directly controls)
4. Condition of the firefighting environment (temp fire hoses and locations, temp EABs location and number)
5. Amount out of times you actually train and drill to fight fires using the temp firefighting equipment above.

Guys, it's not rocket science, so quit making excuses and forcing your sailors to be heroes due to piss poor prior preparations!

8/30/2012 4:29 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

1) Great comments on shipyard fire, especially from all of the competent "Drill Monitors".
BZ to the crew and good luck and God Bless!

2) Don't invest in anything unmanned unless there is a human at the other end of the controls!

3) Someone probably allowed the public to vote the motto in and the crew has to live with it forever.

4) Don't believe reporters!

5) If ABC puts it out there a few things that are guaranteedd. a) it will suck b)It won't be on long.

6) Groton, don't worry some smuck will relieve you of your bad press here soon.

All of your comments reflect the mentality of the typist!

8/30/2012 1:28 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Think about it; for firefighting purposes arson is not a separate and distinct class of fire, is it, genius?

Yet, a government shipyard with no commercial liability, run by Navy officers with no submarine qualifications were in total control of another taxpayer debacle! How could this be the crew's fault?

And how soes the Navy mitigate the disaster? Rather than recognize "sunk costs" it intends to invest
(before inevitable material, labor and cost of money escalations) at least half a billion dollars in an obsolescent hull to satisfy a retiring female Senator with little knowledge of submarines, naval operations or Virginia class advantages.

What brilliant thinking! Certainly Vladimir will approve.

8/30/2012 6:19 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

So Vatter is finally done posting?

Or do all of his supporters write the same way?

8/30/2012 6:38 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

8/30/2012 6:19 PM

Yep, can only imagine how they'll add useless watch standers in the cone to be on the look-out for rogue painter arsonists.

So even though poor planning (lack of hose and EAB stations) is cause for the extensive damage, current and future crews will pay with more shoot the shit watch standing.

The brass fucks up and the TEDs pay the penalty. Par for the course.

8/31/2012 2:52 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Half a billion dollars, mostly for labor, not material, and a steady project for at least 3 years?

No wonder the Maine senators took their constituents into account and sought the initial increment of repair funding for more social welfare, instead of keeping the good of the country first.

Wait....Sorry, I forgot that was Congress I was talking about...Good of the country? Maybe I should get another cup of coffee before I tackle Friday!

8/31/2012 4:48 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Back to the North Dakota logo - I will be transferring to the boat shortly for my next sea tour and happen to think the patch is pretty badass. It incorporates a lot of great features about the state and about the new boat. It's infinitely better than half the ship's logo's out there right now. I am looking forward to working with a great crew as we put the ship through her paces as she joins the worlds greatest Submarine Force.

8/31/2012 6:52 PM

Anonymous ret: ETCS said...

Just because it has to be said somewhere other than the midwatch: Why can we put SMOKE DETECTORS on submarines when we're inport? Portable with velcro or hangers. Stow them when at sea. It's too hard or someone can't figure out how to charge the taxpayer $10,000 for a $30- smoke detector?

9/01/2012 6:59 PM

Anonymous Decay chain fun said...

Just use "the Google" to look up three words at once, ETCS...and the light bulb may come on. Or not.

Those three words: smoke detector Americium

9/07/2012 9:07 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I served with Tommy V back when he was COB of the 724. That dude was a great leader, mentor, and buddy. He would rather teach you how to be a good sailor then drag you through the mud. He knows more about the Submariner life then you will forget. The people that missed out are the ones that didnt use their time wisely to learn from him when you had the chance. You guys that are talking smack on your own kind are probably just as guilty of committing some of the same things; whether it was as an E1 or E9 makes no difference. If it doesn't concern you, then you really don't have the right to know. You may think you do, but you don't. If you are in a leadership position and are still needing lessons learned to teach your junior sailors, then you probably shouldn't be a position to lead yet.
I know there will be those of you who come at me, and some of you that will talk smack to make yourselves feel better. Go for it. But until you have been in the suck with your brother and tried to help him through it, you really don't have a dog in the hunt. I'll post my name because I'm not scared: Josh Williams

9/07/2012 10:35 PM

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9/26/2012 5:42 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

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What Navy is this?

10/13/2012 2:52 AM

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11/23/2012 6:29 AM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I stumbled across this and I am glad I did...if you are talking about Tony Allen from the Texas I will just say if I have known him his whole career and the way you are representing him is completely untrue. I served with him at least twice and he has always been a hard charging chief who took care of his guys. Yes he went through a nasty divorce and drank too much - but I personally know that he admitted his mistakes and went to SARP...and retired on a good note. In addition I visited with him several times and as stated know for a fact he loves children - and not in the way you are inferring. You should be ashamed of yourself for even insinuating that. For shame! A current serving CMC.

12/03/2012 7:29 PM

Anonymous Anonymous said...

If you make untrue allegations like
this then you should put your name to it. I have known him(Tony) for most of his career and personally know what you are saying is not true. I also know the truth of why Tommy was relieved
- it was his own fault - no one else's...I can post those reasons here if you would like(but I don't think you or Tommy want that) - and I will gladly also post my name if you do so as well.

12/03/2012 7:59 PM

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